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SF 97 & Arizona DMV

Rifleman

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Well i took my SF 97 form and went to my local Arizona DMV office today and spent 2 1/2 hours in their office. First off don't expect any of the DMV personnel to know jack about how to turn your SF 97 into a title.

Before i went to my local office i researched all of the state laws that deal with our trucks (in my case i own a M925) and i printed off all this information and took it with me. Please note this was a BIG HELP, i even had the office manage come over to talk to me, telling me i couldn't title and register my truck as non commercial and not pay a weight fee, he told me that there were no Arizona laws that would allow me to do that, this guy didn't know what he was talking about and he was the MANAGER!!!!!`


Since i was ready for every problem they came up with, in the end i walked out of the DMV with my Arizona title and with my registration listing the trucks G.V.W.R. as zero and paid NO WEIGHT FEES AT ALL. Now the G.V.W.R. being listed as zero is VERY important in Arizona, this allows you to drive your 5 ton with just a class D drivers Lic. no need for a CDL, this is per state law. In the end i got the truck plated and registered for 5 years and the total for everything came to $138.50.

I tell you what i had to laugh, i was dealing with DMV employees with over 10 years on the job and they had no idea that the laws and DMV policy's i used to register my truck even existed, afterwards one of the clerks even ask if it would be okay to make copy's of my info so she would know how to handle the next guy that comes in with a SF 97 form.

If any of you need a list of the Arizona state laws and DMV policy's i used to get my truck titled and registered just P M me i will provide you with a complete list.
 

Kawgomoo

Banned
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Location
Phoenix,Az
Im still not sure exactly WHICH number to insist is the vin of the vehicle. is it one from the plate on the door? or do i need to find something stamped in the frame somewhere?
 

hndrsonj

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I am curious how you justified the GVWR as zero. GVWR includes the weight of the truck. I could see major insurance issues if you had an accident.

EDIT: Just saw this was from April....
 

Kawgomoo

Banned
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Location
Phoenix,Az
Yeah i had the same question as well.

Havent received this list of information or any real clarification yet.

im still confused...
 

zout

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I know its an old thread but seeing how it was brought up from the dead: (this is from Arizonia and current) No I am not an attorney nor representing any form of advising - just looking stuff up of what is available. Read #3

28-2531. Registration; violation; classification; exceptions
A. A person is guilty of a class 5 felony who:
1. Intentionally removes a manufacturer's serial or identification number from, defaces, alters or destroys a manufacturer's serial or identification number on or knowingly possesses any removed, defaced, altered or destroyed manufacturer's serial or identification number from a motor vehicle.
2. Is in possession of a motor vehicle knowing or having reason to know that a manufacturer's serial or vehicle identification number has been removed, defaced, altered or destroyed without the permission of the department.
3. Knowingly issues a license plate without payment of the full amount of the registration and weight fee payable on the date of issuance of the license plate.
B. A person is guilty of a class 2 misdemeanor who:
1. Displays or possesses a registration card or license plate knowing it to be fictitious or to have been stolen, canceled, revoked, suspended or altered.
2. Lends to a person or knowingly permits the use of the person's registration card or license plate by a person not entitled to the card or plate.
3. Knowingly fails or refuses to surrender to the department on demand a license plate that has been suspended, canceled or revoked.
4. Uses a false or fictitious name or address in an application for registration of a vehicle or for a renewal or duplicate of a registration.
 

WRMorrison

Member
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Ramsey, IL
If I read that correctly zout, the only person who could be considered in trouble would be the guy/gal issuing the plates/registration...not the owner.

"Knowingly issues (not "obtains") a license plate without payment of the full amount of the registration and weight fee payable on the date of issuance of the license plate."

-WRM
 

zout

In Memorial
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I understand.
But I am not an attorney nor live in AZ and could only be how they interpret it - therefore I sure would look for legal advise there to make sure.

I am a lousy guesser and never play poker.
 

porkysplace

Well-known member
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mid- michigan
If I read that correctly zout, the only person who could be considered in trouble would be the guy/gal issuing the plates/registration...not the owner.

"Knowingly issues (not "obtains") a license plate without payment of the full amount of the registration and weight fee payable on the date of issuance of the license plate."

-WRM
This section addresses GVW of a vehicle , note # 7
28-601. Definitions

1. "Commercial motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle or combination of vehicles that is designed, used or maintained to transport passengers or property in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise, that is a commercial motor vehicle as defined in section 28-5201 and that is not exempt from gross weight fees as prescribed in section 28-5432, subsection B.
2. "Controlled access highway" means a highway, street or roadway to or from which owners or occupants of abutting lands and other persons have no legal right of access except at such points only and in the manner determined by the public authority that has jurisdiction over the highway, street or roadway.
3. "Crosswalk" means:
(a) That part of a roadway at an intersection included within the prolongations or connections of the lateral lines of the sidewalks on opposite sides of the highway measured from the curbs or, in absence of curbs, from the edges of the traversable roadway.
(b) Any portion of a roadway at an intersection or elsewhere that is distinctly indicated for pedestrian crossing by lines or other markings on the surface.
4. "Escort vehicle" means a vehicle that is required pursuant to rules adopted by the department to escort motor vehicles or combinations of vehicles that require issuance of a permit pursuant to article 18 or 19 of this chapter for operation on the highways of this state.
5. "Explosives" means any chemical compound, mixture or device that is commonly used or intended for the purpose of producing an explosion and that is defined in 49 Code of Federal Regulations part 173.
6. "Flammable liquid" means any liquid that has a flash point of less than one hundred degrees Fahrenheit and that is defined in 49 Code of Federal Regulations section 173.120.
7. "Gross weight" means the weight of a vehicle without a load plus the weight of any load on the vehicle.
8. "Intersection" means the area embraced within the prolongation or connection of the lateral curb lines, or if none, the lateral boundary lines of the roadways of two highways that join one another at, or approximately at, right angles, or the area within which vehicles traveling on different highways joining at any other angle may come in conflict. If a highway includes two roadways thirty or more feet apart, each crossing of each roadway of the divided highway by an intersecting highway is a separate intersection. If the intersecting highway also includes two roadways thirty or more feet apart, each crossing of two roadways of the highways is a separate intersection.
9. "License" means any license, temporary instruction permit or temporary license issued under the laws of this state or any other state that pertain to the licensing of persons to operate motor vehicles.

10. "Low emission and energy efficient vehicle" means a vehicle that has been certified by the United States environmental protection agency administrator in accordance with 23 United States Code section 166 or that is part of a federally approved pilot program.
11. "Motorized wheelchair" means any self-propelled wheelchair that is used by a person for mobility.
12. "Official traffic control device" means any sign, signal, marking or device that is not inconsistent with this chapter and that is placed or erected by authority of a public body or official having jurisdiction for the purpose of regulating, warning or guiding traffic.
13. "Park", if prohibited, means the standing of a vehicle, whether occupied or not, otherwise than temporarily for the purpose of and while actually engaged in loading or unloading.
14. "Photo enforcement system" means a device substantially consisting of a radar unit or sensor linked to a camera or other recording device that produces one or more photographs, microphotographs, videotapes or digital or other recorded images of a vehicle's license plate for the purpose of identifying violators of articles 3 and 6 of this chapter.
15. "Pneumatic tire" means a tire in which compressed air is designed to support the load.
16. "Pole trailer" means a vehicle that is all of the following:
(a) Without motive power.
(b) Designed to be drawn by another vehicle and attached to the towing vehicle by means of a reach or pole or by being boomed or otherwise secured to the towing vehicle.
(c) Used ordinarily for transporting long or irregularly shaped loads such as poles, pipes or structural members capable generally of sustaining themselves as beams between the supporting connections.
17. "Police officer" means an officer authorized to direct or regulate traffic or make arrests for violations of traffic rules or other offenses.
18. "Private road or driveway" means a way or place that is in private ownership and that is used for vehicular travel by the owner and those persons who have express or implied permission from the owner but not by other persons.
19. "Railroad" means a carrier of persons or property on cars operated on stationary rails.
20. "Railroad sign or signal" means a sign, signal or device erected by authority of a public body or official or by a railroad and intended to give notice of the presence of railroad tracks or the approach of a railroad train.
21. "Railroad train" means a steam engine or any electric or other motor that is with or without cars coupled to the steam engine or electric or other motor and that is operated on rails.

22. "Roadway" means that portion of a highway that is improved, designed or ordinarily used for vehicular travel, exclusive of the berm or shoulder. If a highway includes two or more separate roadways, roadway refers to any such roadway separately but not to all such roadways collectively.
23. "Safety zone" means the area or space that is both:
(a) Officially set apart within a roadway for the exclusive use of pedestrians.
(b) Protected or either marked or indicated by adequate signs as to be plainly visible at all times while set apart as a safety zone.
24. "Sidewalk" means that portion of a street that is between the curb lines or the lateral lines of a roadway and the adjacent property lines and that is intended for the use of pedestrians.
25. "Stop", if required, means complete cessation from movement.
26. "Stop, stopping or standing", if prohibited, means any stopping or standing of an occupied or unoccupied vehicle, except when necessary to avoid conflict with other traffic or in compliance with directions of a police officer or traffic control sign or signal.
27. "Through highway" means a highway or portion of a highway at the entrances to which vehicular traffic from intersecting highways is required by law to stop before entering or crossing and when stop signs are erected as provided in this chapter.
28. "Traffic" means pedestrians, ridden or herded animals, vehicles and other conveyances either singly or together while using a highway for purposes of travel.
29. "Traffic control signal" means a device, whether manually, electrically or mechanically operated, by which traffic is alternately directed to stop and to proceed.
30. "Truck" means a motor vehicle that is designed, used or maintained primarily for the transportation of property.

 
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Kawgomoo

Banned
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Location
Phoenix,Az
If the mvd clerk tells you to put the gvwr at zero, and sells you the registration you arent in commission of a felony.

Lets get back on the subject of which number is actually the vin? they dont all have 9 or 10 digit serials stamped on the frame like a deuce.
 

porkysplace

Well-known member
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If the mvd clerk tells you to put the gvwr at zero, and sells you the registration you arent in commission of a felony.

Lets get back on the subject of which number is actually the vin? they dont all have 9 or 10 digit serials stamped on the frame like a deuce.
It might help if you state what truck you have , we know what Rifleman has.
 

swiss

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Rifleman or any one that got this information from Rifleman, I would be very interested in the data collected on the laws of the state of AZ and the Title procedures. This would be helpful information for our work in Georgia to change the laws.

Bottom line the more consistant the laws are across the states the more it will help all of us.
 

Kawgomoo

Banned
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Location
Phoenix,Az
I have no idea what it is. I forgot to take a picture of the door tag when i was last down there, because i got so wrapped up in making it run.

Its an ARFF or AFFF truck. to me, it looks like an LMTV chassis, with a weird custom low cg cab. super single, 4wd, hydro over hydro brakes. looks like 5ton kelsey hayes axles, dt466b, allison auto. The serial number started with CH but i cannot recall the 5 digits that followed. Came from the army. looks like it would fit in the back of a c130.

I just need to know which line to point at on the id tag and say see... thats the vin. I find walking into mvd clueless, isnt doing yourself any favors.
 

zout

In Memorial
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Columbus Georgia
Swiss - its nothing you want trust me - it is more vague than SC law in the AZ Code of Regulations - I have it - read it and - nothing else to say about it.
BUT - keep on the main subject as we do not want to get off track again please - it goes no-where.
 

M35A2-AZ

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In AZ if the vehicle is 25 years old and you reg. it as a Historic vehicle there is not weight fee. You also need Historic insurance.
But on the SF-97 you need to list the GVWR.
 

Rifleman

New member
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Here is a little more info and this goes hand and hand with why i need to have the GVRW of my truck listed as zero. When you open this link scan down to section C, that is where you will find the info that ties into the GVRW http://www.azleg.gov/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/28/03101.htm&Title=28&DocType=ARS Then this ARS 28-2484 deals with getting a historic plate for my truck. Now if your truck is at least 25 years old, you can use all these Arizona DMV laws and policys to title your truck historic. Armed with this info you will have no problems with your local Arizona DMV office.http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/28/02484.htm I hope this clears up any questions.
 

hndrsonj

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Hard to argue when the state has it in black and white to enter it as zero. Never seen that before.
 
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