Stock Lock rings? Weldable?

[spicergear]

Flame on boys...

I have a thought on an outer beadlock, for one of my projects, and for mega-ease and simplicity sake i was tossing around the idea of simply machining a center plate the diameter of the outer retaining groove on a stock duece wheel then butting a stock lockring behind it, tacking them...then full circumference welding together and filling the 'seam' where it would be split. This way, the ring is still retained behind a retaining groove, like stock, and would have to swell inside the tire (won't ever happen, like stock won't do either) to come out over, plus it would be welded for ultimate retention. This is kind of an option 'C' for my project wheels. Maybe-

 

[M543A2]

A sketch of your idea would be helpful---
Thanks Marti

 

[wreckerman893]

Sounds like you're reinventing the one piece wheel.

But............ it's your chicken and you can pluck it anyway you want to.

With all the trial lawyers just looking for someone to sue I would think liability would be an issue.

Just my rambling thoughts.

 

[gringeltaube]

When in doubt of weldability, a general rule is to do a small bridge between the two materials involved and test-break it.
You can do this simple test also with the ends of a lockring.... and eventually be surprised that it will break like glass! (% carbon is to high!)
Not saying that it can't be done by using the correct (expensive!) welding electrodes and proper heat treatment. BUT.... does it make sense, economically? And how about SAFETY/LIABILITY, etc!?

G.

 

[GoHot229]

A better idea might be in order, say custom one-piece's for singles for 'BIG' stuff. You sort of blindsided us with that one.........why?, it looks like a lot of work to do to 40 year old wheels ?...... to come out with what exactly ?? Is it a bead-lock your after ?? LIKe M543A2 says.... mabe a sketch would bring us up to speed here.

 

[jasonjc]

How do you get the ring on and off the wheel? How do you get the tire on and off the wheel??

 

[Blood_of_Tyrants]

The problem is that one piece wheels have a dip in the middle of the rim to allow the tire bead to be pushed into while the tire machine takes off the tire. Wheels with bead locks have only a flat rim.

 

[spicergear]

I know that stuff guys...okay...more detail definately needed. The below pics are of an 'A3 wheel. The 'A3 wheel has the rear half with studs for outer lockring and the wheel center. The outer is simply a ring of steel with bolt holes for the locking studs to bolt the halves together and a valve stem hole which is then (as you can see in the valve stem pic) welded to basically a wheel shell with the retaining lip on it. Simple; wheel lip welded to ring of steel = bolt on outer lockring.

My idea would still have the lockring BEHIND an outer lip, like the factory design, but then be welded fully welded like the 'A3 outer pictured. It could not come over the plate ring without expanding the same way a stock ring is trapped from expanding by the tire's heavy bead. Not reinventing a wheel, not converting a non beadlock to beadlock, just fabbing an outer ring and trying to find the a simple method to do so. My other option would be to take 6 stock wheels and cut the rear 2" of the wheel off to gain the same affect. I sure hope nobody says that can't be done since a pile of people have already welded them together- My main concern is if the lockring is heat treated or really...not real weldably special.

Again, simply making an out lockring for an existing beadlock wheel, not modifying a stock wheel into anything.

 

[2Deuces wild]

Is not the A3 rim a 2 piece with a larger O Ring that comes apart when you remove all the bolts around the rim? What happens when you try to install the tire? won't the tire bar cut the tube when it went around the rim if the lock ring was welded to the rim?. I say go for it and post Pictures through out the process. K

 

[M543A2]

I have no problems with deuce or 5 ton rims, so I do not see any reason to mess with the factory design. The military rim lock rings are much better than the civilian ones because they have a longer lip on the ring to go further under the tire bead. This gives a better lock on the rim groove and less chance of a ring blow-off during tire inflation. I have never had a ring failure, I did have a failure of an M-37 rim that rusted through at the ring lock groove on the rim. There was not a lock ring problem.
Regards Marti

 

[spicergear]

Guys...STOP.

I have the back half of a double beadlock wheel similiar to the 'A3 or 5 ton beadlock wheels. I AM NOT MODIFYING A STOCK, TUBE-TYPE, SPLIT RING WHEEL.

I am simply looking to build the outer lockring in a similiar fashion to the 'A3 design where it's a round ring with the bolt holes and a shell with bead lip welded to it. -that's it-

I was asking as to whether or not a split ring ring could be welded to.

 

[m.walker]

Build 1 and try it offroad ( you know abuse it ) .

 

[Coldfusion21]

Guys...STOP.

I have the back half of a double beadlock wheel similiar to the 'A3 or 5 ton beadlock wheels. I AM NOT MODIFYING A STOCK, TUBE-TYPE, SPLIT RING WHEEL.

I am simply looking to build the outer lockring in a similiar fashion to the 'A3 design where it's a round ring with the bolt holes and a shell with bead lip welded to it. -that's it-

I was asking as to whether or not a split ring ring could be welded to.

I would take a file and run it on the ring. if it files pretty easy its a pretty soft material, if the file doesnt seem to want to do much then it might be some heat treated harder stuff.

Get a split ring and weld two chunks together. Clamp in vice and procede to beat with hammer. preferably all you can do is bend the material, if anything.

 

[spicergear]

Nice! Thanks, I'll see what I can round up.

I wasn't sure how much temper, if any they'd have as the shape they have and then rolled into a circle has already bent them once which would make them stronger. I couldn't see the wheel being differently tempered where the ring locks into it so I thought it may be feasible.

I already got a price quote from a local water-jet place to cut the rings out-

 

[gringeltaube]

Spicergear, your intentions were clear to me but .... have you considered cutting off the backside of a stock wheel and weld it to a flange? Unlike the split ring that part of the wheel IS soft steel. Perfectly weldable, best if MIG.

G.

 

[spicergear]

Yep, that's pretty much the back up plan. I was hoping not to have to cannabalize 6 wheels when I could just round up some ring-

BTW...those wheels you made are great!!!

 

[nk14zp]

Build me 4 use 12018 rod i will test them.

 

[BFR]

Spicer,
I am thinking that even if the rings are weldable it would be very tough to weld them the backing plate with uniformity. I know that with enough clamps you could take the "spring" out of the rings, but I from my limited experience playing with them (the rings) I would much rather use the the back side of a wheel.