Stupidity at its Finest

[Diesel Dominator]

So here's the thing. I have no idea where else this belongs. But it concerns the LDT-465 Multifuel Engine

Would this engine fit in an old 1979 Ford F600?

If not, i am curious as to what Civilian vehicles this engine would fit.

Engine swaps are fun but I always see cummins and other crap, and I finally have a working engine, but no Deuce. And as much as I love deuces, i wanna try to stick this engine into something new or different

Alao, would any kinda Allison auto trans work with this btw? I hurt my arm a while back and I'm not sure if I'd be uo to shifting the old Splicer Tranny so I meed a suggestion

Thanks a lot everyone for the advice, anythingis helpful, please let me know if this doesn't belong here.

God Bless

 

[fleetmech]

Dunno if it belongs here, but I'll take a stab at answering anyway.

AFAIK, Ford only offered v8 configuration engines in those year 600s, either the big gassers, the 8.2 detroit 4 stroke, or the cat 3208. Ive seen one or two big f series with 2 stroke Detroits, but not many. Those are some bulky factory engines, so weight shouldn't be an issue, especially if you start off with a diesel chassis. If you start off with a gasser, it might pay to keep an eye on the front springs, but I doubt there is any major difference. The multifuel is longer then those engines, but was itself replaced with 3116's in the M3 Deuce, so its dimensions are not abnormal. The 31 series cat was used in later f series chassis, so it may take some firewall tweaking, or it may not, but you should be in the ballpark.

The Multi is not a real powerhouse of an engine, and it wasn't used much outside the military, so parts and supplies are limited. Thats two major reasons you don't see them swapped into much. Its not huge in the scope of an engine swap, but bear in mind the multi also likes an external lift pump, so you'll have to factor that in too...

I love and wholeheartedly support oddball engine swaps, and this one would be a champion in that regard.

Another option might be sell the multi to a deuce guy, and use the money to pick up a nice 6-71 to slam in that 600... trade the multifuel bark and whistle for a screamin' Jimmy.......

 

[SCSG-G4]

The main 'other' use for the deuce engine was in the White and Oliver tractors. There is an old thread here that goes over those uses as well as in sled pulling (along with some videos when the engines came apart). Good Luck!

 

[V8srfun]

The main 'other' use for the deuce engine was in the White and Oliver tractors. There is an old thread here that goes over those uses as well as in sled pulling (along with some videos when the engines came apart). Good Luck!

what was the thread title I would like to read through that one. I stumbled across one a while back talking about its use in tractor pulls but no pictures.i think the guy was saying he turned his tractor to something crazy like 4,000 rpm!!!!!

 

[SCSG-G4]

It's been at least 8 years since I read the thread, and I've read thousands of threads on SteelSoldiers since then. I can't point you to a specific thread, I just know it exists. I'm pretty sure the videos were on you-tube.

 

[M35A2-AZ]

The main 'other' use for the deuce engine was in the White and Oliver tractors. There is an old thread here that goes over those uses as well as in sled pulling (along with some videos when the engines came apart). Good Luck!

I sold a rebuilt motor in a can to a guy in Iowa that was restoring a (I think) was a Oliver tractor.

 

[gringeltaube]

what was the thread title I would like to read through that one. I stumbled across one a while back talking about its use in tractor pulls but no pictures.i think the guy was saying he turned his tractor to something crazy like 4,000 rpm!!!!!

Pulling tractor with a deuce engine

I do not own a deuce but I have an Oliver pulling tractor that uses a D4800 Hercules engine that is real similar to an ldt-465 except it has the manifolds reversed so that the turbo is on top and the intake manifold is on the bottom. My engine is a 478 cu. in. but I have been told that there is...

www.steelsoldiers.com

 

[frank8003]

Golly.............
Homo sapiens got to where We are NOW because We can IMAGINE

There is a lot of what Has been done and whatitis that One CAN DO

I OK
I still want everything.

DUAL cab M35A2 - Google Search

 

[frank8003]

Why take a multi-fuel and destroy it?
There is much todo

deuce and a half camper - Google Search

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/411586853419622003/

 

[tobyS]

I would put it in my F600 4x4 boomtruck in a heartbeat. But I like the rods too.

 

[Jeepsinker]

Certainly better off selling it and buying a better engine. Engine swaps are a lot of work, and any novelty of having the multifuel in that Ford would wear off quickly when you start driving it and then start having engine problems.
An engine swap is worth doing if you use an engine that isn't weak and failure prone.

 

[Dipstick]

The stock engines in the F600 probably produced more horsepower and torque than an LDT engine does. It would be worth a lot more money in the future to a historic truck collector with the original drive train in it should you decide to sell it. I'm a Detroit two stroke lover myself, but I think a Cat 3208 would fit better in the Deuces engine compartment. We had a 3208 emergency generator at the last place I worked. It ran at 3,000 rpm and I think the power output was about 250 hp. I think they make 310 hp or so with the Cat turbo option. Both are much more powerful than an LDT.

 

[Dipstick]

I was giving this some more thought as a person who has done an engine/drivetrain swap himself. I'm guessing your F600 has a large gasoline V8 engine. The easiest and best thing to do is pull the stock engine and rebuild it. This will allow you to keep the stock clutch, transmission, radiator and driveshaft. The parts should be easily available. Also, an LDT would be longer than the V8 and weigh approximately three times as much. You would have to modify the entire drivetrain which is a very complex thing to pull off. The end result is that you would lose horsepower and torque while possibly overloading the front springs. I'm sorry to butt in or rain on your parade, but in my opinion trying to swap an LDT into an F600 would be a huge mistake/headache.

 

[frank8003]

It has been proven beyond Doubt that some can and did put almost any engine/transmission into almost anything.
You do what it is You wanna do and study and drive it.
Others have had much fun an learned much.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Deuce+and+a+half+rat+rod

 

[Dipstick]

And many more others have regretted attempting it and plowing tons of money into a project that never gets off the ground. You don't hear from them. It's a marvelous idea if you own a fab shop and have ten skilled guys to help you. Consider this.......a V8 gasoline truck engine can turn about 3,600 rpm. An LDT can turn 2,600 rpm. So, if you did the swap (assuming you keep the stock rear gear set, you'd instantly shave about 20 mph off your top speed. Just because something is possible does not mean it's a sound or practical idea. There is a great deal of difference between a pipe dream and a plan.

 

[Dipstick]

Certainly better off selling it and buying a better engine. Engine swaps are a lot of work, and any novelty of having the multifuel in that Ford would wear off quickly when you start driving it and then start having engine problems.
An engine swap is worth doing if you use an engine that isn't weak and failure prone.

I'm with you Jeepsinker. It's a BAD idea. Besides, the old school Ford F600 trucks are way cool just the way they are. I always wanted an F600 six wheel dump myself.

 

[teletech]

So here's the thing. I have no idea where else this belongs. But it concerns the LDT-465 Multifuel Engine

Would this engine fit in an old 1979 Ford F600?

I suppose I generally agree the LDT isn't the best thing to swap into anything unless you just *have* to have a multifuel.
If you have a F600 and want a swap, why not go grab a 7.8 New Holland. Ford used them later in the F600 lifecycle, just before going to Cummins so the swap should be trivial. They use Bosch pumps so at least some of the care and feeding is well understood, but they are different enough to stand out a bit. The 7.8 can make half-decent power without a ton of work.

 

[fleetmech]

I'll bet a 7.3 idi, or 7.3 'stroke if your keen on wiring, would be great candidates for an f600.

Having driven around a lot in a big gas medium truck (1969 Diamond Reo C101), I can totally see wanting to get away from the original gas motors. Its a little bittersweet, but my plans for rehabbing that reo don't include the Gold Comet gasser... Like our Deuces (especially the gassers) trucks like that are a product of a long time ago, when fuel was cheaper and the pace was slower. Im sure we've all seen how belligerent other drivers can get when dealing with a large chassis rig pulling hills at 20mph. If its anything other than a toy, it kind of needs to be able to hold its own. It wont ever be fast, but it should at least be effective. And remember that top engine RPM only influences your road speed for a few minutes...

Going in another direction... assuming this notional f600 has an engine without a lot of potential to be put to work, how about a later gasser swap? A freshened up 460, 440 or 454 from an RV would be neat to see! Maybe a GM 8.1 vortec?? Dont slather it with speed parts, but rather build for torque.

Or go ahead and stab that multi in it and dont worry about us. As long as you enjoy it that's what matters! Its an old truck staying off the scrap pile for a few more years, thats good enough.

 

[Dipstick]

I'll bet a 7.3 idi, or 7.3 'stroke if your keen on wiring, would be great candidates for an f600.

Having driven around a lot in a big gas medium truck (1969 Diamond Reo C101), I can totally see wanting to get away from the original gas motors. Its a little bittersweet, but my plans for rehabbing that reo don't include the Gold Comet gasser... Like our Deuces (especially the gassers) trucks like that are a product of a long time ago, when fuel was cheaper and the pace was slower. Im sure we've all seen how belligerent other drivers can get when dealing with a large chassis rig pulling hills at 20mph. If its anything other than a toy, it kind of needs to be able to hold its own. It wont ever be fast, but it should at least be effective. And remember that top engine RPM only influences your road speed for a few minutes...

Going in another direction... assuming this notional f600 has an engine without a lot of potential to be put to work, how about a later gasser swap? A freshened up 460, 440 or 454 from an RV would be neat to see! Maybe a GM 8.1 vortec?? Dont slather it with speed parts, but rather build for torque.

Or go ahead and stab that multi in it and dont worry about us. As long as you enjoy it that's what matters! Its an old truck staying off the scrap pile for a few more years, thats good enough.

Wow fleetmech, can you give us a picture of your Diamond?! I drove a 54' or something International R-190 with a huge Continental gas engine and a 5 sp crashbox. I know exactly what you mean about people having no patience for slow moving old fashioned trucks. Boy, I'd rebuild that Gold Comet myself. I think the 460 is the most practical suggestion I've heard yet for the F-600. One thing, the combination of top engine rpm, transmission top gear ratio, rear axle ratio, and tire diameter always limits your top speed unless you stick it in neutral and go on a suicide roll down a hill. Another thing is, that even a relatively low torque diesel like the LDT would soon shred a gassers rear end. Gasoliine engines stall when you overload them. Usually before the drive train breaks. A diesel won't do that. It will keep trying to pull up to the point of throwing a rod or twisting a drive shaft. I once snapped the transmission output shaft clean off a Mack R-600 tandem tractor I got stuck in mud and rocks. The 237 Maxidine kept right on running.

 

[fleetmech]

I'll have to see if I have a picture of her back when she was still done up and running. Its alarming how time can fly. Sadly, in a way, the engine in it is in fantastic internal condition. I tracked down its last 'real' owner, who rebuilt it with "just about the last full rebuild kit on the east coast" and that includes new liners. Another reason for not using it, aside from power, is lack of parts. Long story short, their water pump bearings are overstressed and prone to failure. Im on the second pump, which is failing, and those things were unobtainium ten years ago. Id like to set it up as a running display on the flat bed.

As for the trans and axles, I guess it all boils down to exactly which ones it has, and its intended useage. I certainly wouldn't put an M11 in it and run at max gvw all day, but any of the engines weve suggested should be fine in, say, dump, bucket, crane or other light vocational use.

For the speed, I only meant to say that op should focus on cruising speed/ rpm, not top, since big old gassers dont like prolonged rpm any more than Diesels do. My Reo Gold Comet is rated for 171hp, but at 3600 rpm. I estimate its lifespan at 3600 to be less than a minute before rods come flying out the sides. Its torque curve was almost identical to a contemporary diesel, running between 15-2200.