The beast died after hitting a bump!!

[gimpyrobb]

I wouldn't just flat out ignore the batteries, but thinking the amperage is the cause is not realistic.

I'd get a carbon pyle tester and verify they are good.

I'd agree about the pcb being the cause, swap it out with a known good one.

 

[74M35A2]

You guys are no fun. I was liking the too many amp thing.

Given your climate, I would go buy 2 new group 31 batteries, update to a modern gear reduction starter, and be done with it. Batts are $100ea and starter can be had for about $250. Starter pulls 50 amps less current, has consistent cranking speed across all temperatures, weighs half of stock, is 1/3 smaller, and also has a self contained relay so you can bypass the truck mounted 60's style PCB solenoid for the starter. Start switch wires direcrly to starter. Updated, new, low cost, under warranty, and done. All for less than $500. Modern simplicity and reliability at its finest.

 

[Brutacus]

You guys are no fun. I was liking the too many amp thing.

Given your climate, I would go buy 2 new group 31 batteries, update to a modern gear reduction starter, and be done with it. Batts are $100ea and starter can be had for about $250. Starter pulls 50 amps less current, has consistent cranking speed across all temperatures, weighs half of stock, is 1/3 smaller, and also has a self contained relay so you can bypass the truck mounted 60's style PCB solenoid for the starter. Start switch wires direcrly to starter. Updated, new, low cost, under warranty, and done. All for less than $500. Modern simplicity and reliability at its finest.

That sounds like a better idea, and I'm starting to not like the PCB. Before I replace the starter with a gear reduction and all that stuff, I'm going to check and verify everything else. If it's just the PCB and it needs replaced, or rebuilt if possible then I'll do that first. The only reason we think too many amps could be a cause is because, hitting that hard jarring bump, it knocked something loose, which caused it to short out and burn it out. If the amps where lower, maybe it wouldn't have burnt out. As big block 88 said, these truck are simple for a reason. I have been going over the TM and everything we troubleshooted pointed to the starter on the solenoid. With that ruled out, I'll check the PCB. That thing seems to be a big headache for people here. I'm starting to get a headache.

 

[Jbulach]

You guys are no fun. I was liking the too many amp thing.

Given your climate, I would go buy 2 new group 31 batteries...

What you afraid your new fangled starter can't handle all those Amps?

Fun with too many AMP things... tell the story about dropping the socket on the battery cable while wiring up your new flux capacitor!

Sorry, I couldn't resist, getting boring without pictures of you and IGM sisters...

 

[doghead]

Any loose connection of your batteries will allow the alternator to go to full output(and burn out) and this will cause over-voltage.

If you think you have a bad battery disconnect switch, replace it.

 

[Brutacus]

What you afraid your new fangled starter can't handle all those Amps?

Fun with too many AMP things... tell the story about dropping the socket on the battery cable while wiring up your new flux capacitor!

Sorry, I couldn't resist, getting boring without pictures of you and IGM sisters...

I can't get any pictures to LOAD!! That is just as frustrating as the PCB!!

 

[big block 88]

Trust me... Drop the too many amp thing. Thats not the case. We run d8's just fine in our truck and 3 others one being an 816 with nhc250.

Gear reduction starter is a great idea. I have one sitting here in the garage. Issue is the factory wont die, so starters are very tough but they do go out. If you hook 24 volt direct to the starter does it work? Make it easy on us man try some of these super simple jumps on the starter and battery kill switch and see what you get.

 

[74M35A2]

Yep, it happened. I dropped a 2' long 1/2" drive extension between the engine block and live starter B+ stud. Oil filter started hissing, engine ground harness glowed white hot through the convolute, and then vaporized the wires inside, leaving only insulation behind. It was like a harness of rubber tubing only. No engine ground wire conductors were home after that. Was pretty sweet.

The stock starters are very robust. I sell almost zero gear reduction units due to it. But you all know my take on the POS alternator. Even the pulley nut can't do it's single assignment. Over-volt is for the birds. None of todays units do that, even the Chinese Delco clones don't. The stock units can fail in about 7 different ways.

 

[gimpyrobb]

If folks knew HOW MUCH BETTER life is with a gear reduction starter, they'd swap over. I love mine!

 

[Jbulach]

Yep, it happened. I dropped a 2' long 1/2" drive extension between the engine block and live starter B+ stud. Oil filter started hissing, engine ground harness glowed white hot through the convolute, and then vaporized the wires inside, leaving only insulation behind. It was like a harness of rubber tubing only. No engine ground wire conductors were home after that. Was pretty sweet.

The stock starters are very robust. I sell almost zero gear reduction units due to it. But you all know my take on the POS alternator. Even the pulley nut can't do it's single assignment. Over-volt is for the birds. None of todays units do that, even the Chinese Delco clones don't. The stock units can fail in about 7 different ways.

Thanks for sharing that story again!

It really helps one recognize the damage that can be done by shorting batteries.

I went to add a cable to the stud on the solenoid just a couple of days ago... As I stood there looking at it, wondering if I should cautiously install it hot, I thought of your story and quickly may up my mind to disconnect the batteries.

 

[doghead]

If folks knew HOW MUCH BETTER life is with a gear reduction starter, they'd swap over. I love mine!

Do you sleep better too?

 

[gottaluvit]

If folks knew HOW MUCH BETTER life is with a gear reduction starter, they'd swap over. I love mine!

So how does a person;

1.) Know if they have a gear reduction starter?

2.) Know if they have a more modern "reliable" alternator?

 

[Jbulach]

So how does a person;

1.) Know if they have a gear reduction starter?

2.) Know if they have a more modern "reliable" alternator?

M925A2

Factory starter.

Dreaded military 60 amp alternator.

The good stuff will look obviously different.

 

[Ford Mechanic]

Send it to me, I'll fix it and send it back, and tell you what was wrong with it. The guys are right, there's nothing that can be caused by to many amps in a battery. Think of the amp rating as "availible amps" components can't draw more than what they require unless they have something malfunctioning inside which would be very obvious due to the smoke. Corrosion and loose connections draw amps and can act as a load in a circuit causing heat, burned connectors, and burned wires. Also reducing voltage to the components in the circuit causing them to malfunction.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

 

[Brutacus]

Send it to me, I'll fix it and send it back, and tell you what was wrong with it. The guys are right, there's nothing that can be caused by to many amps in a battery. Think of the amp rating as "availible amps" components can't draw more than what they require unless they have something malfunctioning inside which would be very obvious due to the smoke. Corrosion and loose connections draw amps and can act as a load in a circuit causing heat, burned connectors, and burned wires. Also reducing voltage to the components in the circuit causing them to malfunction.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

I'm scraping the too many amps thought, but my old battery cables had serious corrosion all through out them. Not to mention the sheathing had been rubbed of in several places. I have since fixed this. That should have remedied any symptoms that would have caused, unless some of the components were damage from those old cables. But, I still think something else was knocked loose, because that bump I hit was bone jarring. How can I test the PCB to see if it was affected? I tried that "tap it with a hammer" and nothing happened. I checked my battery disconnect switch, and all of the connections are good and clean even though the switch feels as if it's loose on the inside, so I'm going to replace my battery disconnect switch after next payday. If the new battery cut-off switch doesn't fix it, is it safe to assume the PCB is bad? Now My batteries are still showing good with my battery tester, so even if the alternator is bad, shouldn't the truck at least start while the batteries have a good charge but would show on the voltage meter as not charging?

 

[gottaluvit]

Yes, the batteries would start the truck regardless of the alternator's condition, if fully charged good batteries.

You could just momentarily bypass the battery cut off switch to check it. Not like we have taxpayer funding to just throw stuff at these beasts.

 

[big block 88]

Yep. Why not just jump around the kill switch? Wouldnt you sleep better at night if this was solved? Im someone who freaks out and will not sleep till i at least have diagnosed something.

 

[lindsey97]

I don't yet have enough experience with the gear reduction starters, if they actually use less current or not, and so on. I did replace one of my starters with a gear reduction starter. Diameter is definitely smaller, and this makes a huge difference when reinstalling, because your socket/extension can now remain concentric with the bore of the fastener you are trying to install. They are also much shorter, but the biggest difference for me was the physical weight reduction of the whole unit. A gear reduction starter is so much easier to install than the stock style. I am in good health, excellent mechanic, and I work on bigger equipment on a regular basis. I hope they do consume less current, this would be a great benefit for our hobby because most of us only run 2 batteries.

 

[gimpyrobb]

So how does a person;

1.) Know if they have a gear reduction starter?

2.) Know if they have a more modern "reliable" alternator?

1. The sound it makes, you would know right away.

2. If it looks similar to the one posted and its rated at 60 amps, its probably stock military.




As an aside, I've not really had issues with them(stock alts) in my deuce or multi powered wrecker. (but I do have 100a aftermarket sitting on the shelf just in case.)

 

[gottaluvit]

Have never seen a data plate on my alternator but havn't looked either. Both look like the above pictures, but my starter zips pretty quick.