Towing with an M0178 or other LMTV

[blozup]

Short version:

If the tow vehicle is rated for 10,000 lbs, and the trailer is rated for 14,000+ lbs GVWR is it still OK to tow if the actual weight of the trailer is, say, 8,500 lbs?

Long version:

What I'd really like to be able to do is get a 2 car trailer and tow it with an M1078. I've read the M1078 has a towing capacity of 10,000 lbs, though, and most 2 car trailers start at 14,000 lbs GVWR (7,000 per axle, virtually all are at least double axle).

The cars I want to tow are 2,600 lbs and 3,200 lbs (measured curb weight). The GVWR is 3,100 and 3,600 respectively.

So, assuming a 2,000 to 2,500 lb trailer, that's just under 8,500 lbs total. Even using GVWR of the in-tow vehicles, that's only 9,200 lbs.

So is it still safe to tow this even though the GVWR of the trailer is over the listed towing capacity of the tow vehicle? More specifically, anything I need to know about towing with an LMTV?

 

[DiverDarrell]

Trailers behind an lmtv equal Commercial drivers license. As far as tow ratings, the lmtv is rated to tow another fully loaded one. Before you tow anything read up on the laws. Also considering my 8000 pound pickup can tow 20000+ pounds. I'm sure a 17k pound medium duty truck is better than 10k.

 

[tburk49760]

Can it do it versus is it legal are two totally different questions. In order to be able to even tow an empty trailer capable of more that 10k in my state, I spent lots of time on the phone with each agency concerned. DOT, DOL, and WSP " Washington State Patrol. In the end, WSP won because as they told me " we have the guns, no one else can really enforce anything" now I have a farm truck license and can legally tow up to 40k, no cdl. The limits are supposedly mileage from the farm less than 150. The WSP rep told me that they don't typically enforce that...fun stuff...

 

[blozup]

Trailers behind an lmtv equal Commercial drivers license. [...] Before you tow anything read up on the laws.

Interesting. Completely forgot to check on the licensing required. I looked into this for my state: http://www.state.nj.us/mvc/Commercial/CommercialDriver.htm

Looks like for an LMTV ~25000 lbs + 10,001 lbs trailer = Class A (!) CDL

Guess I can start driving 80,000 lb tractor-trailers then as well.

As far as tow ratings, the lmtv is rated to tow another fully loaded one.

Yes, but that is the sole exception to the TM that specifies 12,000 lb "Maximum Towed Load" - TM 9-2320-365-10, 1-23

I have a feeling it wouldn't have a problem towing a say, loaded 14,000 lb. 2 car trailer. But how do you know what is just understated vs actually safe?

Also considering my 8000 pound pickup can tow 20000+ pounds. I'm sure a 17k pound medium duty truck is better than 10k

Hm, if you're trailer is over 18,000 lbs that puts you over the GCVWR of 26,000 lbs, needing a CDL (in NJ). Hm, I see two car trailers pretty frequently at race track events behind 3500/F350s and whatnot. I doubt many of them have CDLs, but I also never asked...

 

[blozup]

Can it do it versus is it legal are two totally different questions.

Well, for now, I'm asking whether it's safe to do. The legal part can be overcome, although it looks annoying and possibly expensive.

In order to be able to even tow an empty trailer capable of more that 10k in my state, I spent lots of time on the phone with each agency concerned. DOT, DOL, and WSP " Washington State Patrol. In the end, WSP won because as they told me " we have the guns, no one else can really enforce anything" now I have a farm truck license and can legally tow up to 40k, no cdl. The limits are supposedly mileage from the farm less than 150. The WSP rep told me that they don't typically enforce that...fun stuff...

I didn't realize 10k lb trailers were such a big deal.

It looks like in TX, my former state, you could get a class A non-commercial license for personal vehicles > 26,000 lbs. Oh well.

 

[DiverDarrell]

Safe as long as you have a brake controller set up properly , and don't exceed the tire or axle ratings on the trailer. Also keep the proper weight on the tongue. If you dig into it deeper you will also learn weight on the tongue equals weight removed from the trailer axles. Gives you more wiggle room.

 

[Ben55GMC]

<bump/updates?>

Short version:

If the tow vehicle is rated for 10,000 lbs, and the trailer is rated for 14,000+ lbs GVWR is it still OK to tow if the actual weight of the trailer is, say, 8,500 lbs?

Long version:

What I'd really like to be able to do is get a 2 car trailer and tow it with an M1078. I've read the M1078 has a towing capacity of 10,000 lbs, though, and most 2 car trailers start at 14,000 lbs GVWR (7,000 per axle, virtually all are at least double axle).

The cars I want to tow are 2,600 lbs and 3,200 lbs (measured curb weight). The GVWR is 3,100 and 3,600 respectively.

So, assuming a 2,000 to 2,500 lb trailer, that's just under 8,500 lbs total. Even using GVWR of the in-tow vehicles, that's only 9,200 lbs.

So is it still safe to tow this even though the GVWR of the trailer is over the listed towing capacity of the tow vehicle? More specifically, anything I need to know about towing with an LMTV?

You can tell by looking at the vehicle that it is designed like the cab forward medium duty cargo trucks favored in Europe and Japan, where population density and road width make trailering less desirable. Think Fuso, Isuzu NPR/NQR, and etc. Usually those vehicles are more comparable to our van trucks (like a step van), which have reduced tow ratings.

The advantages are that the cab forward trucks can turn on a dime on tight roads and trails, while getting more cubic feet and lbs of cargo on the chassis. The trucks with the motors way up front usually aren't set up for constant or heavy towing, and usually the transmission or the breaks become the weak link. Not that the engineers are being cheap? I suspect (but don't know) that if your engine is at the very front of your vehicle platform, and you attach a heavy trailer to the rear, it would, in effect, be a bit more similar to towing a tandem/two trailer rig. Lots more movement going on at the rear of the tow vehicle than in a vehicle set up for towing. Movement that can translate to stress. (This can be compensated for by using a more stable fifth wheel placed well forward on a cab forward tractor truck).

I'd listen to the engineers, and avoid damaging the drivetrain. Then again, the truck itself weighs a lot more than an offering from Isuzu. I'm interested in maybe sourcing one of these trucks in the future. I'm curious to hear how the heavy towing is working out?