Trying to get a title for my truck. ARG!!!

[racerlee]

The DMV here in Oregon is wanting me to try to find vin #s on my 44 chevrolet 1 1/2 ton to get a title. The only number I can find is the serial # on the data plate inside the cab, but they say that isn't the right number they need. They want the stamped number off the engine. I can't find a stamped number on it. Does anybody know where to find it? Thanks.

 

[eaw46]

You may find a number stamped on the right frame rail just ahead of the wheel. Eddy

 

[NDT]

Sounds like they want the "motor number". I'm not a stove bolt 235 expert, but on the GMC 270 that number is stamped on a little boss near the distributor.

 

[CatMan]

The engine serial number begins with 270 and is located in two places on the engine if your truck has an original engine. Stamped number on the right side next to the distributor and on a small square data plate down low on the left side of the cylinder block.

There is plenty of information on the web site www.CCKW.org Check it out

See page 15 of the TM 9-801 shown here.

Cat Man
1945 CCKW Dump Truck

 

[racerlee]

Thanks guys for the replies. So far I still can't find any numbers. It seems as if the motor has been changed. Inside the cab someone wrote that the motor has been changed in 53. So I guess I'll keep looking.

 

[NDT]

I have a stack of titles for the 1.5 ton Chevy and the motor number always starts with "BV" and then 6 numerals. I have 2 stove bolt 6's in the warehouse and I will check them over tomorrow for the number location.

 

[paulfarber]

The engine serial number begins with 270 and is located in two places on the engine if your truck has an original engine. Stamped number on the right side next to the distributor and on a small square data plate down low on the left side of the cylinder block.

There is plenty of information on the web site www.CCKW.org Check it out

See page 15 of the TM 9-801 shown here.

Cat Man
1945 CCKW Dump Truck

CCKW GMC 270's start with 270... but the 235s in the 1.5 ton Chevys would not. Most GMC will have a data plate on the lower left side (drivers) with a SN, bore, stroke. Its referenced in the TMs and SNL.

I would find another smarter DMV minion. You do not want to use something that could change. If you title by the engine number then if you change the engine your title is void, as it no longer matches. Do you have Notary Publics that you can go through? I used 'The John Yurconic Agency' local office in Pottsville. They knew their stuff, and other than a small processing and courier fee my CCKW, Jeep, and trailer titles all went through without a hitch.

Use the frame SN. MODERN VINS have specific digits that will tell them the engine info for emissions.. thats most likely what they are looking for.

In PA, since there was no VIN that fit the computer template I had to get a rubbing, and have a State trooper verify it and sign it as an exact copy. That is my VIN now.

All you ever wanted to know about Chevy engine/VINS

stovebolt casting numbers

 

[NDT]

OK, I checked my two WWII 235's and neither of them have a number stamped in the boss to the left of the distributor. I think what has happend over the years is this: New in the crate surplus 235's used to be available super cheap in the 1950's. What people would do is junk the worn out motor and buy the new 235 and go on with life, without stamping in the motor number in the blank boss on the replacement engine. I agree that using the motor number is stupid as opposed to the frame serial number (VIN), but that was how it was done in the past in many states including my own. There used to be a DMV form for when you swapped engines just for this purpose. I would do like Paul said, take a high res pic of the vin data plate and present that at a different DMV office as evidence of the VIN. .

 

[jimm1009]

The serial number on the data plate is what they call the VIN now days.
A modern day US VIN is 17 digits and yours is not, of course.
The serial number is what the title should have on it.
My Willys CJ2A is a 5 digit serial number.
My 1930 model A Ford car is a 4 digit serial number.

If you use something else it will never reflect the serial number which is the production number too. A modern day VIN has country of origin, transmisison number, engine model number, finished trim number, and other stuff included with the actual serial number (porduction number) incorporated at the very end. Your vehicle does not have all this "stuff" incorporated as you are well aware.

Using the engine number is incorrect because engines are replaced and while not historically as valuable as a car or truck that have all the numbers matching, would really screw up your title as it would no longer have the correct serail number engine which would mean you would not be able to prove ownership because you no longer have the right car, which is "B.S."

Tell them that the manufacturer tracks the serial number on the data plate and that is what is supposed to be on the title.
Is this a vehicle that came from another state by chance? If it is then the other state's papwerwork should have the serial number listed on it somewhere along with the manufacturer, model year, and model number or model name.
Keep us posted.
jimm1009
PS: My CJ2A came from my uncle who purchased it brand new in 1946 and I am the 2nd owner. It still has the original engine installed although it has been rebuilt once and the engine serial number is now where close to the vehicle serial number but yet that is the way it came from the factory.

 

[racerlee]

Thanks guys. NDT, thank you for the info on the engine. Now I know why I can't find a number. For a number on the frame I can't find one either. What I know about the truck it has been in Oregon for along time. The license plate is a Oregon plate from 55, but the state has no records of it. I do agree that the data plate serial number should be used as the vin. If there is a frame number should it be the same as the data plate serial number?

 

[jimm1009]

Personally I would thnk so but I am not an expert on your model.
Hemmings Motor News is a really thick magazine and is certainly a good place to start on finding restroation information and vendors but there are probably forums now for your make and model too.
I would consult with a shop that performs restorations on your style vehicle as they go through this all the time.
Good luck,
jimm1009

 

[paulfarber]

Your frame number may be filled with layers of paint. Its there.... may have to sand the frame a bit (no grinding!).

I would also NOT use a data plate. Same reason as an engine number... it can easily be removed. Find the frame number.. you will need it to establish production info and configuration.... plus its just cool to know.

While *most* original frame SNs will be reflected correctly on the data plate (if its an original) you could still be in a bind when your data plate SN does not match a frame SN. Whatever is NOT removable would 'win'.

The odds of that ever coming up? I don't know.. maybe when you least expect it? Or you get a cop that knows where it is and actually checks?

 

[racerlee]

Does anybody know where the frame number is located? I've been looking but have not been able to find it.

 

[paulfarber]

Here's what the frame SN looks like:

"the numbers are stamped on the frame behind the drivers side front tire"

G503.com Message Forums • View topic - new g506

 

[racerlee]

Thanks paulfarber, I'm sure thats on the outside of the frame rail. But I've sanded my frame and its blank. So what now? It doesn't look like anybody removed the numbers by grinding or anything like that. Are all the 1 1/2 ton chevys in that location?

 

[paulfarber]

Use paint stripper. Paint may have filled in the stamping.

You may have to do the whole frame rail from the cab to the bumper... 'behind the drivers front tire' is a starting point.

 

[Unforgiven]

Go through a title company. It might cost a few hundred bucks. But they'll find some clever way of getting you a legal VIN & title from the DMV.

 

[paulfarber]

Worse comes to worse buy a set of 3/4th in stamps and pound one into a frame rail.

Every state has exceptions for antique vehicles... all you need is a frame stamped VIN. Short of finding the original (my be some work, but having a title that has the proper VIN can increase collectors value) make one up. The expense is much less than a title co and from what I've read not all states take them.

My CCKW had a title made for less than $100, I described the PA method above.

 

[racerlee]

Ok thanks everyone for the information. I'll see what I can do for now.

 

[mastergunner53]

racerlee,
here is my 2 cents, the data plate in the cab should be used and is correct to use.i would forget about the engine numbers and frame numbers. Most dmv people are idiots when it comes to a vehicle that does not have 17 digits in the vin!!
Many military vehicles even in the korean war did not have frame numbers. I suggest u go to the highway patrol and get a vehicle verification done using ur data plate. If the highway patrol does not do that in Oregon, then go to the local police department and take a vehicle verification form that you get from the dmv.
Then fill out a statement of facts and write down that the data plate is the origional serial numbers If the dmv still has a problem, so it takes any blame off of the dmv person . get it?
I have had to do this many times to many vehicles, and i have had many confrontations with stupid dmv people that don't have a clue!
Here the highway patrol can issue you an vin number sticker, but i suggest that as a last resort!!!! USE THE ORIGINAL VIN NUMBERS ON THE DATA PLATE!!!!! And don't go to the same dmv person.
These suggestions i gave you are the ways we do it in California (north mexico)

I strongly suggest you do NOT stamp numbers on a frame, in some states it is a felony!! don't do it!!!
Also, here in CA. we use the AAA club to do most of our registrations needs and the people are so much nicer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good luck , Richard