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Ultimate 5 ton tractor

red

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Okay so does anybody make a compound setup for the 8.3?
None off the top of my head but it wouldn't be that complicated to set up. Being for a towrig your turbos won't be a huge size difference. Will need to get turbo maps for the turbos you are interested in on a similar or same sized engine.
 

Csm Davis

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None off the top of my head but it wouldn't be that complicated to set up. Being for a towrig your turbos won't be a huge size difference. Will need to get turbo maps for the turbos you are interested in on a similar or same sized engine.
That's just it red only compound turbos I have seen on an engine this size are competition tractors. I would like 5-600hp but don't need it, if I could buy a system that I knew would be reliable I might do it but this will need to be a tried and true system because I will be going to Alaska and other out of the way places, I am not saying no but that I will need to see it on other trucks first.
 

zebedee

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... Do I need to sharpen my "pencil" or do you already have a composite picture planned!!!.....?
 

Recovry4x4

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Between the Spicer 6453 trans and the T1138 tcase you will have a .56 overdrive ratio, giving you a low rpm at 60-65mph with either 11" s or 395's, right around 1800. Depending on your power requirements you might want to consider a compound turbo setup
If that is too much overdrive, consider a 6352 with 1:1 final drive.
 

zebedee

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Wrong cab/hood I know, but...

Ultimate tractor.jpg

Ultimate tractor rear.jpg

right cab, still wrong wheels.
 
Last edited:

4XDesign

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Probably going to leave the rear axles in the stock location and cut of extra bit of frame, but I had thought about moving them to the rear but that would not be worth the extra work.
This will be an awesome build!! I'm not sure I completely understand the 800 series and 900 series cab configuration.
Moving the axles is no big deal just take a rubber hammer to knock off the rivets...
image.jpgimage.jpg
Also what benefit is compound turbos? I am seeing 35pis or better from the stock turbo. Are y'all thinking that more boost is possible for the 8.3? I have a giant intercooler and I can't keep it cool. Granted it makes a whole lot of power but there is still more useable fuel on tap. I would not be opposed to adding a different turbo or building a combo setup. I'll be curious to see what you come up with.
 

73m819

Rock = older than dirt , GA. MAFIA , Dirty
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This will be an awesome build!! I'm not sure I completely understand the 800 series and 900 series cab configuration.
I believe the reason is this, the tubs are narrower in the front then the back, and a 939 tub is wider then a 809 tub by 9", I am guessing that the back of a 809 tub width is close to the width of the front of the 939 tub, if this is the case, there would be no need to spread the front of a tub to make a 4 door tub.
 

red

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This will be an awesome build!! I'm not sure I completely understand the 800 series and 900 series cab configuration.
Moving the axles is no big deal just take a rubber hammer to knock off the rivets...
View attachment 604684View attachment 604685
Also what benefit is compound turbos? I am seeing 35pis or better from the stock turbo. Are y'all thinking that more boost is possible for the 8.3? I have a giant intercooler and I can't keep it cool. Granted it makes a whole lot of power but there is still more useable fuel on tap. I would not be opposed to adding a different turbo or building a combo setup. I'll be curious to see what you come up with.
Reasons for compound turbos is for extra power and for the power to be at the correct rpm. Each model turbo has a certain range where it works best. Usually a stock turbo is chosen because it reaches maximum efficiency at the designed engine rpm for operational use, lets say 2000-2400rpm (just throwing that number out). Above and below that range the turbo is out of its efficiency window. Below its not building maximum boost, above that it's heating the intake air much more than is required when compressing it, leading to higher EGT's and other issues.

Compounds provide you with 2 of these windows across the rpm band. For a towrig setup you want the windows close to each other. The lower window is where your cruising rpm will be (or right above it). The smaller turbo will be at its maximum efficiency, with the larger turbo not quite there but it is spooled up.
 

Landbarger

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Patrick County, VA
Are y'all thinking that more boost is possible for the 8.3? I have a giant intercooler and I can't keep it cool.
This is a question that comes to my mind. I know M809 and early M939s both used the NHC250, but do they have the same airflow and radiator on them? It seems like there's a lot more grill space on a M939 nose, so what are your thoughts on whether the M809 front end can provide adequate cooling for the 6CTA? (I feel like this must be a stupid question since it hasn't been brought up yet.)

But I love the idea and much prefer the M809 front end to the M939. So I'll be looking forward to how this comes out.
 

porky69

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Coaldale, Alberta, Canada
Also when a single turbo is used above its design parameters (higher boost), while it does create more boost it also creates huge amounts of heat, which increase intake temps and cause the motor to run hot. This excess heat is hard to drop even with a large intercooler.

Proprly designed Twins will allow for more airflow through a wider range.

Turbochargers are a highly engineered addition to an engine to work properly.
 

ROCKWELL-C60

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franksville wi
Get a 250 Cummins, the 8.3 is a dog on the low end and I can't stand the one I have. 8.3 will beat My 250 on a straight out drag race but when I hook up to my M 146 it won't even hardly move it to the turbo kicks in and on a hill I have to put it in low range just to take off. Cubic inches beat turbo for grunt but I'm collecting parts to big cam my m925 and really kick some butt. THERE'S NO REPLACEMENT FOR DISPLACEMENT unless you're worried about fuel economy.
 

Csm Davis

Well-known member
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Hattiesburg, Mississippi
Get a 250 Cummins, the 8.3 is a dog on the low end and I can't stand the one I have. 8.3 will beat My 250 on a straight out drag race but when I hook up to my M 146 it won't even hardly move it to the turbo kicks in and on a hill I have to put it in low range just to take off. Cubic inches beat turbo for grunt but I'm collecting parts to big cam my m925 and really kick some butt. THERE'S NO REPLACEMENT FOR DISPLACEMENT unless you're worried about fuel economy.
This is true, but have you turned up your 8.3 the difference is huge and it can easily go up to 350 HP, the 250 cannot be bumped that much, now if I had a 400 sitting around that would be in it, but I have come to realize that little 8.3 will do probably more than I need.
 

Csm Davis

Well-known member
4,160
393
83
Location
Hattiesburg, Mississippi
This is a question that comes to my mind. I know M809 and early M939s both used the NHC250, but do they have the same airflow and radiator on them? It seems like there's a lot more grill space on a M939 nose, so what are your thoughts on whether the M809 front end can provide adequate cooling for the 6CTA? (I feel like this must be a stupid question since it hasn't been brought up yet.)

But I love the idea and much prefer the M809 front end to the M939. So I'll be looking forward to how this comes out.
I believe that the radiator in the 809 is as big as the 939 but turned 90° from each other if not they are close and I know the 8.3 doesn't need all that is there, the military used a much smaller radiator under the intercooler on the electronic 8.3L
 

Csm Davis

Well-known member
4,160
393
83
Location
Hattiesburg, Mississippi
I believe the reason is this, the tubs are narrower in the front then the back, and a 939 tub is wider then a 809 tub by 9", I am guessing that the back of a 809 tub width is close to the width of the front of the 939 tub, if this is the case, there would be no need to spread the front of a tub to make a 4 door tub.
Ron is correct about why, I also like the look of the front cap on the 809 series. I will probably be turning the rear doors around but not the rear cab, so I will have suicide doors on the rear for easier access to the back seat.
 

JohnnyBM931A2

Member
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Location
Crystal Lake, Illinois
This is true, but have you turned up your 8.3 the difference is huge and it can easily go up to 350 HP, the 250 cannot be bumped that much, now if I had a 400 sitting around that would be in it, but I have come to realize that little 8.3 will do probably more than I need.
Agreed. And getting twice the mileage per gallon makes the 8.3 a winner, especially when the price of fuel (inevitably) goes up again.
 

wheelspinner

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Get a 250 Cummins, the 8.3 is a dog on the low end and I can't stand the one I have. 8.3 will beat My 250 on a straight out drag race but when I hook up to my M 146 it won't even hardly move it to the turbo kicks in and on a hill I have to put it in low range just to take off. Cubic inches beat turbo for grunt but I'm collecting parts to big cam my m925 and really kick some butt. THERE'S NO REPLACEMENT FOR DISPLACEMENT unless you're worried about fuel economy.
Not to sidetrack too much, but my A2 with a PROPERLY tuned / turned up engine has no trouble off the line. I towed my Deuce, both trucks loaded with an extra set of tires, extra Allison etc.. prob 19-20K extra weight on the tow bar and in the bed and had zero trouble with it for 750 miles. Much better pull than my older 5 ton with the 855 in it. I used to complain about the exact same problem with power out of the hole, until my friend (who is an old-school Cummins mech) came up and turned it up right in about 10 mins. Never ever will I go back. JMO but I have had both and know my opinion is founded on experience.
 
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