Using a MEP generator to charge your EV?

[williamh]

Using dead Dino’s to power your ev. Next thing you now you’ll be wanting the gen to power your lights n such

 

[Chainbreaker]

Using dead Dino’s to power your ev. Next thing you now you’ll be wanting the gen to power your lights n such

Or do both!

Sure why not? When the power goes out due to a litany of causes...rolling blackouts, "the big one", hydro power failures, etc. etc. how are those owners with EV's going to use them? If you already have a capable MEP rather than doing monthly load tests why not use an EV to accept that power & put it to good use?

For those that are already off grid & utilize a MEP for home battery bank charging its a no brainer if they have or end up with an EV in their future.

I don't have an EV yet...but we have a diesel car & truck but as EV's range & battery technology advances I can see myself going that route eventually & want to be prepared to utilize my small stable of MEP generators whenever appropriate.

Edit for clarification: I put a ? mark at the end of the thread title for a reason. I wasn't suggesting to use ~$6/gallon diesel (as its currently priced out here) to routinely charge an EV versus using utility power or a commercial EV charging station.

Currently my electrical rate, which is based off the Bonneville hydro-electric power serving our local utility, is ~8.85 cents per KWH so home L2 plug-in grid charging would be the most economical. Intent was to discuss the feasibility of having the added at home capability of using a MEP and to utilize otherwise wasted load tests via charging an EV versus using devices like ovens, garage heaters etc. to do load test/exercising. As well as to have the back-up capability of EV charging when the power goes out. The practicality of doing that using an MEP was brought to light by the linked article on using a diesel genset generator to power a charging station in the remote outback of Australia. It showed not only that it was being done for remote off-grid locations but it was as efficient or better in some cases as burning diesel in a diesel engine powered vehicle.

Anyway, I understand your initial reaction, that was initially mine too until I explored the reason they were doing it and the test results piqued my interest.

 

[kayak1]

....
Currently my electrical rate, which is based off the Bonneville hydro-electric power serving our local utility, is ~8.85 cents per KWH
....

That is a great electrical rate in Maine with optional time of use I am paying $0.17 per kWh off-peak and $0.34 kWh on peak.

 

[Weldman]

Very informative article, thanks! So, judging by the charging times shown in the spreadsheet contained within the highlighted hypertext in my initial post the "Tritium" branded charger they used fed by the large generator sitting next to it had to be a Level 3 charger.

However, what I am am interested in discussing is mainly the use of a MEP with 120/240 capability to supply Level 2 charging rates. However, if one has only a Level 1 or Level 3 capable generator that's not out of the realm discussion here. There are Pros & Cons I'm sure.

Of course, if one has a 5kW model MEP generator vs a 10kW or greater, the amps difference would obviously impact charging times. Personally, I would be content with taking a few hours to charge an EV at home or a house battery bank augmented with solar panels. I've always been of the mindset that slow charging is gentler on batteries than hi-rate fast charging due to heat buildup. However, it seems that newer Li-ion EV batteries may be more tolerant of fast charging.

Depends on what batteries you are charging... Lead acid have 3 stages, bulk which is where it takes up to .15C (depending on your battery specs) then drops down to absorb is next stage and then float for the last stage of really low amperage. Not slamming a lead acid battery with enough current will cause it to sulfate and die a early death. The battery that powers my home is 2010AH, which means it can take 300 amps that is more than any single phase charger can put out at same time it can go as low as 100.5 amps.
LiFePO4 can take up 1C AKA Li-ion as some know it but never charge it below 32 degrees Fahrenheit, keep them above 50% DOD though they can go down to 20% DOD.

 

[Chainbreaker]

That is a great electrical rate in Maine with optional time of use I am paying $0.17 per kWh off-peak and $0.34 kWh on peak.

Yes, we are fortunate to have reasonable electricity rates in our area, however we aren't as fortunate with our fossil fuels... as of yesterday Diesel is $6.35, premium gas $5.99, regular $5.65 at our closest Shell station. If it gets much worse we may be in the market for an EV sooner than expected.

 

[kayak1]

Yes, we are fortunate to have reasonable electricity rates in our area, however we aren't as fortunate with our fossil fuels... as of yesterday Diesel is $6.35, premium gas $5.99, regular $5.65 at our closest Shell station. If it gets much worse we may be in the market for an EV sooner than expected.

If you are looking for a non-road trip (city car) you might look at the 2023 bolt https://www.cars.com/articles/2023-chevrolet-bolt-evs-price-cut-makes-a-good-thing-better-450666/ after the issues with the fires they are dropping the price for them a lot. I would install a charger outside and make it live outside.

 

[Guyfang]

Yes, we are fortunate to have reasonable electricity rates in our area, however we aren't as fortunate with our fossil fuels... as of yesterday Diesel is $6.35, premium gas $5.99, regular $5.65 at our closest Shell station. If it gets much worse we may be in the market for an EV sooner than expected.

On 6 June it cost about $7.80, here in Germany.

 

[Mullaney]

On 6 June it cost about $7.80, here in Germany.

.
Is that $7.80 per liter?
Making it almost $15 a gallon?

 

[Weldman]

Here is the battery that runs my place before I installed it

 

[Chainbreaker]

If you are looking for a non-road trip (city car) you might look at the 2023 bolt https://www.cars.com/articles/2023-chevrolet-bolt-evs-price-cut-makes-a-good-thing-better-450666/ after the issues with the fires they are dropping the price for them a lot. I would install a charger outside and make it live outside.

Well that 2023 Bolt is tempting to consider & put on the EV radar. Though, given our situation with 4 vehicles to insure & maintain amongst the other ranch utility vehicles to maintain its hard to justify adding another vehicle to the stable. However, I do have a gasoline car (Audi S4 Avant) that I might consider letting go while used prices are up... Hmmm

By the way, your caveat about homing the Chevy Bolt outdoors along with its range limitations is why I've hesitated to enter the EV market.

The video at the bottom of that link discussing the differences on home charging stations was very informative!

 

[Guyfang]

.
Is that $7.80 per liter?
Making it almost $15 a gallon?

No. A gallon. And its dropped a BUNCH from 2-3 weeks ago!

 

[Guyfang]

If you are looking for a non-road trip (city car) you might look at the 2023 bolt https://www.cars.com/articles/2023-chevrolet-bolt-evs-price-cut-makes-a-good-thing-better-450666/ after the issues with the fires they are dropping the price for them a lot. I would install a charger outside and make it live outside.

Fires happen way more then you think. AND, the charging stations also have that problem. Mostly its because "Hobby Electricians" install them. Here in Germany, the Gov has started giving people the cost of a small car charging station, and the installation charges back to people who install the stations. Lots of them get installed "improperly", and that's becoming a bigger problem. My DIL got the whole family one each charging station, per house. No, none of us have an electro car, but since Germany intends to ban all Internal Combustion Engines by 2035, we are now going to be "prepared". I will install mine on the outside of the garage wall, with a CB inside the garage to keep freeloaders at bay.

 

[kayak1]

Fires happen way more then you think. AND, the charging stations also have that problem. Mostly its because "Hobby Electricians" install them. Here in Germany, the Gov has started giving people the cost of a small car charging station, and the installation charges back to people who install the stations. Lots of them get installed "improperly", and that's becoming a bigger problem. My DIL got the whole family one each charging station, per house. No, none of us have an electro car, but since Germany intends to ban all Internal Combustion Engines by 2035, we are now going to be "prepared". I will install mine on the outside of the garage wall, with a CB inside the garage to keep freeloaders at bay.

I checked ( https://www.southwire.com/calculator-conduit )to make sure that the 3/4 pcv conduit I running 60' across the yard for the temp location my MEP-802a will be able to support 4 x #6 THWN conductors as I will replace the generator connection with an EVSE to charge my Cubertruck if it ever shows up (at the rate it's going that might be 2030).

With the Telsa EVSE you can limit the VINs that can use the charger:

Gen 3 Wall Connector Access Control

The Charging Access Control feature gives you full control over which cars are allowed to charge with your Wall Connector.

www.tesla.com

 

[DieselAddict]

The lithium batteries I use at home and at on the off grid property for power I keep between 30% and 80% SOC. I use a MEP831 at the off grid property to charge the batteries if the solar can't keep up. I can bring the pack up to 80% in about 2.5-3hrs of run time on the MEP. That is enough to run the Minisplit and the fridge for about 36 hours during the peak of summer or winter when its used most. That nets me around 0.5 gallon of diesel per 24 hours of power. Thatis way more fuel efficient than running the generator for long periods of time very lightly loaded. I have the inverter programed to draw 2.7kw from the MEP831 for battery charging.

Its the same at the house, if I get low on power during a utility outage, I'll run the generator for a couple of hours to bring the batteries up then shut it down. The big battery at home can run the critical loads on a full charge for a couple of days. Thats a LOT less fuel than running it for the entire outage.

I'd say that putting in a 10kw or more solar array would be the ticket to charging an EV if you have the room and plenty of good sun. Solar panels are CHEAP these days. I bought 14kw of panels that were surplus from building a big solar farm for about $2,500. These are top quality utility grade panels. You can find some real deals out there if you look around.

 

[rickf]

Just a curiosity question here, no politics, but since "the big one" has been mentioned I want to know what happens to EV's when the EMP hits? I am thinking after that the only thing they are good for is a bonfire. The MEP's will run on forever as long as you can find fuel because they have no electronics but the EV's have 40-50 computers on board.

 

[kloppk]

... The MEP's will run on forever as long as you can find fuel because they have no electronics ...

Actually all the MEPs have electronics in them. Items such as Voltage regulator, S14, Fault Monitor, Overload unit, Over voltage unit, Governor Controller...
However the MEPs are deigned to meet the HAEMP spec MIL-STD-2169 so that they can survive a High Altitude EMP event.

 

[Chainbreaker]

Just a curiosity question here, no politics, but since "the big one" has been mentioned I want to know what happens to EV's when the EMP hits? I am thinking after that the only thing they are good for is a bonfire. The MEP's will run on forever as long as you can find fuel because they have no electronics but the EV's have 40-50 computers on board.

Earlier in post #22, I made a reference to "The Big One" and didn't even consider it may have a different meaning in different parts of the County. Depending on where you live the "Big One" takes on a different context. On the West Coast its generally associated with a BIG Earthquake 7.8 or greater.

Here's an interesting article from "Scientific American".

It's understandable that if you live near a large Military presence or large U.S. Gov't control entity the "Big One" takes on a different meaning being subject to potential EMP, nuclear fallout, etc.

On the West Coast, "The Big One" likely covers both scenarios! I hope I never have to face either situation but advance preparation & knowing what to do afterwards is certainly a key factor to one's survival. Hopefully, my outdoor located MEP's mounted on their trailers would survive either event!

 

[rickf]

I am wedged between NYC, Philadelphia and Washington DC. Don't think I will have to worry too much about it if it happens. Just a thought for those who were thinking along those lines.

 

[kayak1]

I am wedged between NYC, Philadelphia and Washington DC. Don't think I will have to worry too much about it if it happens. Just a thought for those who were thinking along those lines.

I wonder if the Russians know that the Maine Brunswick naval air station is now just an airport. That or being within a few miles of https://www.gd.com/en/our-businesses/marine-systems/bath-iron-works might also make my location a target.

In any case, if it's not raining next weekend I will hook an EV to my MEP-802a and see how it does. I have two plug options:
1. L14-30 will charge at 240v 24amps.
2 6-20R will charge at 240v 16amps.

The MEP-802a won't support a 140-50 plug, I am not sure about pulling 24amps for an extended period of time.
What would people like to see in terms of a plug?

 

[Chainbreaker]

I wonder if the Russians know that the Maine Brunswick naval air station is now just an airport. That or being within a few miles of https://www.gd.com/en/our-businesses/marine-systems/bath-iron-works might also make my location a target.

In any case, if it's not raining next weekend I will hook an EV to my MEP-802a and see how it does. I have two plug options:
1. L14-30 will charge at 240v 24amps.
2 6-20R will charge at 240v 16amps.

The MEP-802a won't support a 140-50 plug, I am not sure about pulling 24amps for an extended period of time.
What would people like to see in terms of a plug?

Perhaps do the 6-20R and depending on the results consider if the L14-30 could be appropriate for the MEP-802a. However, it would depend on one's circumstances... If you have a need to use an EV as a load bank for monthly genset exercise/tests perhaps the larger amp charging rate is in order to get the load 80%+.

If testing a real-life utility power outage scenario and you needed to keep house powered overnight for the basics, could you also slow charge the EV simultaneously overnight using 6-20R charge rate?