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CUCV 1986 M1008 - In a Real Pickle - Bad Heads - Need Advice

Commander5993

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any reason not to put a temp sensor for a temperature gauge, in the same place as the idiot light temp sensor, except on the opposite head?

EDIT:
HA i got a good reason... there isn't any port there. I could have sworn I saw a plug there... oh well. I'll figure out somewhere to put it.
 
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ken

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QUOTE:Wow Ken, you've been on here a long time. You joined SS even before the internet existed :mrgreen:
Yea That was done as a joke by Mike. He used to be a mod here. It's been so long I cant even remember what the joke was about. Al Gore just thinks it was him who invented the internet!
You can mount your temp gauge at the front of the drivers side head. But your idiot light wont work, but then again you wont need it. I don't like mounting them there because it sometimes touches the casting. So you wind up seeing a hotter temp because it is reading the top of the combustion chamber. You will think your overheating when your not. Under a load the temp will show to skyrocket then it will drop when you let off the throttle. If you can get a crossover from a 6.2 Humvee you can place it in the port there to be accurate. But that's for a later time. Lets hear it run!
 

Commander5993

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QUOTE:Wow Ken, you've been on here a long time. You joined SS even before the internet existed :mrgreen:
Yea That was done as a joke by Mike. He used to be a mod here. It's been so long I cant even remember what the joke was about. Al Gore just thinks it was him who invented the internet!
LoL
Wow Ken, you've been on here a long time. You joined SS even before the internet existed :mrgreen:
You can mount your temp gauge at the front of the drivers side head. But your idiot light wont work, but then again you wont need it. I don't like mounting them there because it sometimes touches the casting. So you wind up seeing a hotter temp because it is reading the top of the combustion chamber. You will think your overheating when your not. Under a load the temp will show to skyrocket then it will drop when you let off the throttle. If you can get a crossover from a 6.2 Humvee you can place it in the port there to be accurate. But that's for a later time. Lets hear it run!

Well... Here is my UPDATE:
I finally figured out where a "mystery" fuel line coming off the fuel filter base which I had been looking at for a week thinking it was the drain... it was a rubber hose with what looked like a piece of brake line with fitting stuck in the end and hose clamped on... but apparently that is how it was made from factory. As I finally figured out it went to the center of the IP right in between all the injection lines, which of course were now all under the intake... that was pill to get my big hands in there, and snake the line up through all the injection lines, get the nut started, and even worse trying to get a wrench on it to tighten it up. :roll:

Anyway got that done, put a new fuel filter on, dropped the batteries in and etc. I thought I had got everything buttoned up... so I pushed it out of the garage around 2 o'clock this afternoon. I filled the radiator with distilled water, first thing the thermostat housing started dripping... So I took it apart and found that the thermostat had dropped out of the groove it was supposed to sit in, so since I had used gasket sealer, I had to clean it all up and make another gasket. Got it put back together, without sealer this time, re-topped off the radiator, no more leak.

I pulled the pink wire on the IP, and cranked the engine a couple times. Then we found that there was a water leak toward the bottom drivers side of the radiator. And there was an oil leak back further under the engine. So we pushed the truck back in the garage to take a look.

The oil leak is apparently coming from the plug above the oil lines right above the oil filter. Which I had taken that plug out a couple weeks ago with the intention of putting a mechanical oil sending unit there, but long story short that didn't work out, I have since bought a new electrical sending unit and gauge. So I when I went to put the plug back in, it didn't want to go... of course. I fought with that for an hour or so, and when it did go in, it felt tight, but I thought maybe it was just the thread tape I had on there... was hoping it didn't cross thread, but that is now my guess as to what happened...... so I've got to fix that now.

The water leak
on the bottom drivers side of the radiator, we thought at first was the drain. So I snugged that up, still didn't stop... so I snugged up the actual nut that is the drain plug "assembly".. still didn't stop... So I pulled that drain plug out, and put in another I had that was the same thread etc. Still the leak didn't stop... I knew at that point (with certainty) that apparently when the truck overheated when the head gasket blew and it lost its water, it must have blown a hole or cracked one of the... "lines" or whatever you want to call them, in the radiator...
We closed up the garage and quit for the day, as I've got to run to town to pick a couple things since tonight at sunset begins Sabbath. So I won't work on it tomorrow it be Sabbath, depending on what is going on the next day, which is Rosh Chodesh/"new moon", I might pull the radiator then, if not then it will be the 1st day of the week/wednesday. But I'm pretty sure I'll need another radiator, as this is not the original. We got this radiator about 4 years ago when we were on the road, and were in Montana and it was 95+ all that week. The original radiator had a seam unzip right when we were passing through the middle of Missoula right down the main drag during apparently rush hour. My Mom was driving the truck at the time, and we had to circle around and she got it stopped and shut off in a grocery store parking lot. We had to have it towed to a gas station on the outer edge of town, which had a large gravel parking lot.

Since we were on the road, we just went to napa and ordered a new one for $400... it took 3 different radiators over the course of a week before they got one that my Dad and I felt might not leak, as the previous two look like they had been dropped off a truck and beat up... in any case, we finally got one and were able to get it in, and continue on our way after sitting at that gas station for a week.

I don't know why I didn't just think about trying to find someone to repair the original... I've wondered that ever since, and worse yet we got rid of it shortly after that simply because our trucks and two cargo trailers were so full at the time, as we were living out of them, and it was always in the way.

Anyway, I am 99.9% sure that I'll have to find another radiator. Would like to find someone here on SS with one really, rather than these cheap made replacements. I certainly will never buy another from napa to say the least, haven't liked this thing since we bought it.
 

cucvrus

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They are all the same radiators now. All made in Mexico and have the # 850 in the part number. All the ones I buy are warranted for life. I have several in snow plow trucks that get used hard and they hold up well. I would recommend replacing the mounting isolaters when you do the radiator replacement. All you need is a radiator that keeps the truck from over heating. If they were made out of canvas and kept the truck cool I would buy it. I prefer the plastic tank aluminum fin. Other the copper and brass.Still some all aluminum. All are fine with me. As long as they are warranted and keep the truck cool. They are the right one. 3 core 4 core what ever. Keep the engine cool. I pull a trailer with my stock M1009. it is slow and heavy at times. It gets hot but not overheated. The brass copper replacement radiator was $300. and I received a free Yeti 20 oz. coffee cup. It is warranted for life and it keeps the truck cool. I just bought one 2 months ago. Same part number B850 $300. and it was plastic and aluminum. Fits well in my M1008 project. I would buy again.DSCF3035.jpgDSCF3034.jpgthis is the old one from my project M1008. Factory Harrison. DSCF3409.jpgDSCF3410.jpgDSCF3411.jpgDSCF3412.jpgDSCF3413.jpgDSCF3414.jpgThe new one fit and looked original. Should keep the engine cool. Have a great day. $318.
 

Commander5993

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They are all the same radiators now. All made in Mexico and have the # 850 in the part number. All the ones I buy are warranted for life. I have several in snow plow trucks that get used hard and they hold up well. I would recommend replacing the mounting isolaters when you do the radiator replacement. All you need is a radiator that keeps the truck from over heating. If they were made out of canvas and kept the truck cool I would buy it. I prefer the plastic tank aluminum fin. Other the copper and brass.Still some all aluminum. All are fine with me. As long as they are warranted and keep the truck cool. They are the right one. 3 core 4 core what ever. Keep the engine cool. I pull a trailer with my stock M1009. it is slow and heavy at times. It gets hot but not overheated. The brass copper replacement radiator was $300. and I received a free Yeti 20 oz. coffee cup. It is warranted for life and it keeps the truck cool. I just bought one 2 months ago. Same part number B850 $300. and it was plastic and aluminum. Fits well in my M1008 project. I would buy again.View attachment 695836View attachment 695837this is the old one from my project M1008. Factory Harrison. View attachment 695838View attachment 695839View attachment 695840View attachment 695841View attachment 695842View attachment 695843The new one fit and looked original. Should keep the engine cool. Have a great day. $318.
Yeah, this napa one has metal tanks, and now I actually would say the plastic tanks are better (so long as they don't crack like this other truck we've been using did), over the box store metal tanks, as these metal ones are flaking off alot of paint and are already starting to rust, and its just 4 years old.

Lifetime Warranty....... Hummm......... napa's website states that all their radiators have lifetime warranty. I wonder if ours is still under warranty??
Thanks for bring up that point! I'm going to have to check into this and at least see. Might call and see if I can find out that way, as the closest napa is 45 miles from here. Sure would be nice if it is under warranty.
 
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Commander5993

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I posted this last night... but I posted it on the wrong thread :doh:

-----------
Been kind of down the last couple days, but just wanted to post a quick update.
We took the radiator to a repair shop today, they said they should have it fixed tomorrow [friday], so we'll see.
I did pick up a couple brass plugs today, but I haven't removed the oil plug yet that was leaking. Hopefully tomorrow i'll feel up to it and I can get the plug out and run a threader in there (again), and these new brass plugs will thread in easily and fix the issue. Still don't understand why before I could run the threader in there by hand without a problem, but yet the original steel oil plug would only go in 1/2 to one thread before it would just stop dead by hand, and was hard to turn in by a wrench even though the threads on the plug looked perfect... :shrugs:
 
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Commander5993

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Update.... well I never heard back from the radiator shop yesterday, I even called them and no one even answered. So I left a message, never got a call... and at this point I don't expect to until monday... its not that it is going to take to monday that aggravates me... its that I was told twice that they would have it done friday, and as such I was expecting to get it back in and have the truck running this weekend.

On top of this... now our deuce won't start, which is something we've never had a single issue with before in the last 6 years we've owned it. It usually starts right up almost as soon as you hit the start button. It ran perfect a couple months ago, my father hadn't driven it lately because he had been sick. But he went to start it the other day, and nothing. Over the last two days, we've changed all the fuel filters, bled the system, drained the fuel and put fresh in... nothing, not even a hit like its trying to start... guess I'll have to start another thread in the deuce forum :-(
 
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Commander5993

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PU :D (Post Update):
Since I mentioned it earlier, thought I would follow up in this thread too.

We at least got the deuce running today! It was the stop plunger in the IP. Another SS member sent a link to one of GP's threads, about how to take the side cover off the IP and remove the stop plunger, clean everything, put it all back... hope the engine doesn't run away...

But after seeing that, I got to thinking that if the stop plunger was just stuck "a little bit", then maybe I could gently tap on it with a hammer and it might knock it loose. So thats what I did, I tapped on the cover, the mounting bolts, etc, and tried to crank her again, and she fired right up!
So since we had 5 gallons of fresh diesel in the tank already, I put a strong mixture of power service, sea foam, a little lucas fuel cleaner, and also added some MMM (marvel mystery oil) for some added lubrication. We let her run for a couple hours, added another 5 gallon of fuel, added some more fuel cleaner, let her run some more, then my father took her for a drive for a bit.
Seems like that has taken care of the issue. We didn't really want this to happen, but the fuel filters did need changed anyway, and the fuel in the tank was getting old, which is probably why this happened in the first place. Need to give it an oil and filter change, and few other things, and it should be back up to ready to drive. :driver:

In any case, at least we made some progress on something... now if I can just get the oil leak fixed on the CUCV... AND get the radiator back from the repair shop... we should finally be getting everything rounded up and FINALLY finished.
 

ken

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I know I will get flamed for this but NEVER leave a multi fuel parked for a long time with the engine stop pulled. The shaft WILL rust and stick. I know I know the procedure said to park it that way. That's just incase someone hit it with another M35 and moved it enough to push start it. But Just leave it parked in reverse will the cable pushed in and some sort of wheel chock. Sorry for being off topic
 

85CUCVtom

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The only direct swap in another 6.2 or a 6.5 if you do not get a Navistar 6.5 I would probably stick with a 6.2
you can get heads for a 6.5 and put on your 6.2 if the bottom end is in good shape. aftermarket heads are a crapshoot also.
Are you referring to the GEP 6500 Optimizer and the GEP P400 motors, I thought those were Navistar branded castings. Aren't those pretty good motors?

Didn't mean to highjack the thread but I had to ask.
 

Commander5993

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I know I will get flamed for this but NEVER leave a multi fuel parked for a long time with the engine stop pulled. The shaft WILL rust and stick. I know I know the procedure said to park it that way. That's just incase someone hit it with another M35 and moved it enough to push start it. But Just leave it parked in reverse will the cable pushed in and some sort of wheel chock. Sorry for being off topic
Yeah, I know, and you're right actually. We chuck the tires anyway, and where we have it parked normally, it isn't going anywhere.
 

Commander5993

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UPDATE:

The Good News:

Well, got the radiator back in and filled it up with distilled water, at least its not leaking so far. We'll see what happens once I start the truck.

The Bad News: (why does bad news always seem to be longer.....)
I don't know why I hadn't already done this back when I first began working on the truck.... :doh:

I figured with the head gasket blowing and with had having the engine apart, the most likely got contaminated. So I figured I would put a cheap crap fram filter that I bought on it, and some rotella T (which I don't like to run anymore since they changed it) in the truck, as I have the oil on hand. Then run it for a bit, run some engine flush in it, drain it again pull the filter, put on my mobile one filter that I usually run and mobile diesel oil.

So I went to do the first oil change and I pulled the oil plug and I would guess 1-2 quarts of coolant came out first. :shock::shock::shock: It might just look like more than it really is, as it overshot my drain pan and most of it went out on the floor. In any case, this isn't good. I know with the head gasket blowing that it could have gotten some water in the oil, that is understandable. However, with as much as what it looks like... I'm hoping and praying that it didn't cause further damage.

I guess I'll find out here after while, I'm going to let it drain as much as possible, turn the engine over a bit, see if I can get any more out, and then refill it with the Rot T and fram filter. Crank it to circulate it through, and then start the truck...... but I just drained the oil and removed the filter as
 

cucvrus

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Don't turn the engine over with NO OIL in it. That will do more harm then good. Just drain it good and refill it with a new filter. Hopefully the head gasket problem is solved. That coolant could have gotten in during the head gasket changing. Could have. Lets hope. I am an optimist. Give it a try before you condemn it. Good Luck. Report back.
 

Commander5993

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Don't turn the engine over with NO OIL in it. That will do more harm then good. Just drain it good and refill it with a new filter. Hopefully the head gasket problem is solved. That coolant could have gotten in during the head gasket changing. Could have. Lets hope. I am an optimist. Give it a try before you condemn it. Good Luck. Report back.
Yeah, didn't mean like that. I already filled it back up. Trying to prime the fuel system... I'm forgetting something though, going to have to go back through the TM.

In any case, I finally found that my oil leaking (pouring) out of the plug above the oil cooling lines (which are above the oil filter), isn't the plug that I thought it was from. There was a second plug removed (by someone) which is above the plug I thought it was leaking from. I didn't even know this hole was there, and not sure what plug is supposed to go back, as I haven't found any in any of my parts boxes. I think I may have one that will fit it though...
Why is there Two Plugs there? Guess they had a purpose for something rather...
 

Commander5993

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well... found the problem... at least the latest problem as they never seem to end...

The reason the fuel pump wasn't pumping is that I did screw up the fuel pump install somehow, and apparently when I cranked the engine over the first time a week ago it broke the end (or more) off the push rod. Some good it does for me to do "preventive maintenance"...

When i took the mounting plate off, a piece of rod fell out that is approx 5" long, wow I was way off... the piece that fell out is only 3.5" long.

Is this just a straight rod end to end as the TM seems to show?
I tried to see if I could put a magnet in there, but was not able to pull anything out. Guess it is probably waiting in there to screw up the rest of the cam shaft.

EDIT:
What is the chances, or is it even possible, the other half the push rod dropped down into the oil pan?
 
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ken

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Yes that it the correct rod. Look at your broken one. Is it machine ground/polished on each end? Or do you have a broken jagged end? The reason I ask is normally the fuel pump arm bend/breaks before the rod. Post a Pic? If it is polished on both ends it's not broke. When you reinstall it or the new one, Grease the OD of the rod before you push it back into the hole. This will hold it in place while you install the pump. Makes the install go much easier!!! You might have to rotate the engine by hand to get the cam lobe out of the way. This will allow you to get the pump base closer to get the bolts started.
 

Commander5993

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Yes that it the correct rod. Look at your broken one. Is it machine ground/polished on each end? Or do you have a broken jagged end? The reason I ask is normally the fuel pump arm bend/breaks before the rod. Post a Pic? If it is polished on both ends it's not broke. When you reinstall it or the new one, Grease the OD of the rod before you push it back into the hole. This will hold it in place while you install the pump. Makes the install go much easier!!! You might have to rotate the engine by hand to get the cam lobe out of the way. This will allow you to get the pump base closer to get the bolts started.
Yeah, its broke. One end is rough, other end is machined.
Here is a couple pics of the 3.5" piece that fell out when I removed the fuel pump mounting plate:

IMG_4507.jpg IMG_4508.jpg


So.... where would the other 1.75" piece have went... would it have dropped into the oil pan?

What would you guys recommend...
Should I remove the pan and try to find it?
Or would it hurt anything to just stay in the oil pan?

I wouldn't think it could get back up into the engine...??
 
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