few questions for a newby

[SeeNebraska]

can someone walk me through how i should drive an flu419? i looked at one today but the seller is the wife of the guy who used to use it. She knows nothing about it or how to use it and her husband isn't available to help.

i got it started, cycled the loader, checked out the backhoe, got it to latch in and stow away. then when it came time to drive it, i started having issues.

what is the basic theory of operation for the different levers. there is the I/II/R selector as well as the 1/2/3/4 selector with the high/low switch mounted on the rod. are you expected to use the high/low switch when working up to convoy speed?

The clutch is leaking fluid somewhere so the pedal doesn't feel great and requires a lot of pumping to build up. If the clutch isn't disengaging, will it give me trouble changing gears and speed ranges?

my trial driving today was a big failure but i'm thinking a lot of it was my fault.

the front loader was inconsistent in its movements, sometimes it wouldn't actually move up, other times it would but sounded rough. Would that be from air in the system? the backhoe cylinders leak pretty bad so it was very low on fluid when i first started looking it over.

thanks

 

[peakbagger]

I cant comment about the clutch issues but some really basic background on the transmission. its 4 speed conventional transmission with a two Hi Low gearboxes bolted to it. Unless you are carrying loads just shift it into hi (II) on the selector and then shift normally with the stick. No need to split shift it with the air shifter. All the air shifter does is splits each gear into a effectively two gears. Great if you are hauling a heavy load like trailer but no need in normal use.

Things to keep in mind

SEEs come with synchronizers on the 4 speeds. They are tender for a couple of reasons. There is lot of mass moving around and if you try to shift fast its just wearing the rings faster. The manual says shift slow and I concur. The other reason is that Mercedes specifies GL4 transmission fluid which is an obsolete but still available fluid. GL5 is the current spec and its not backwards compatible, it is known to eat synchronizers. Most SEEs are very low mileage and the wear doesn't happen instantly but I have talked to the former SEE factory mechanic who worked with the military and one of his reoccurring jobs was to go the recon facilities to train and lead mechanics through transmission rebuilds to replace synchronizers. Most folks get confused as most GL5s are labeled as "replaces" GL4. There are couple of options in Europe but Goldline Synthetic GL-4 is reportedly approved by Mercedes and Amsoil offers a GL4 (it is also specified for a few imports like Toyota trucks) and available in the US.

Yes trying to shift any vehicle without disengaging the clutch is not good. Sure you can minimize the damage by double clutching but it still pounds on the synchros.

When you do get it driving, shift it into 4wd. You should feel the steering tighten up as the front axle is now locked to the rear axle. You may hear air leaks and keep an eye on the air pressure. If it drops quickly you have air leaks in the air pressurization system or 4WD activator. Now at slow speed preferably on dirt, turn the selector to differential lock. In theory a light should light up on the warning panel under the tiltmeter. The steering should get much tougher to turn. Also keep an eye on the air pressure, if it drops faster, you may need to replace air lines to the lockers. If the lockers don't engage, you may be able to free them up or you may have to tear the axle apart to put in new seals, the parts are cheap but its take a lot of time do install them. I expect most folks would try to free them up and live without them if they cant free them up.

FYI trying to drive an unknown condition SEE can cause long term damage unless you go through the greasing and lubrication procedure. At a minimum you really should check the portal axle fluid and if its been sitting change it. If there is any evidence of leaking around the portals assume the worst. If the portal axles are low or if there are chunks in it, it is a very expense repair well in excess of $1,000 and requires a lot of hours and special tooling or a phone call to C&C equipment which will sell you rebuilt in the crate sets of axles for $5,000. The other thing to check is the ties rods and drag links on the steering. They may have been permanently lubricated but Mercedes didn't factor in that the boots fail allowing grit to get in them. At a minimum you need to grab onto them and make sure they are tight. Most of the these can not be replaced so if they are loose its several hundred dollar repair to replace the entire tie rod and links with parts from Europe.

With respect to the front end loader, the loader is fed from the same pump as the power steering, it probably is air in the system. How does it steer?

Its a really tough situation buying a vehicle without access to the person who was running it. It makes it easy for plausible deniability by the wife and also prevents you from figuring out if the prior operator knew what he was doing or if he was just running it into the ground.

 

[peakbagger]

Hi Folks, I did makes a mistake on the power steering. The loader and hand tools is run off a engine driven pump separate from the power steering. The loader is fed from the tank in the rear next to the oil cooler. The power steering is fed from a separate power steering pump with its own reservoir. I was repeating something I read elsewhere but when I looked up on the technical manuals, these are definitely separate. Thus the SEE could steer well yet the loader may not work.

So with loader not working well, it could be low reservoir in the rear, or possibly a plugged filter in the reservoir tank.

 

[SeeNebraska]

My issues seem to have stemmed from incorrect instructions left by the previous owner. I was led to believe the loader and backhoe were all fed from the passenger side reservoir and that the driver side reservoir was only for the aux tools. I know the driver side reservoir is basically empty so i'm surprised the front bucket worked at all! Is there a risk of damage when operating the hydraulics with low fluid or will it just not work? I'll go fill the CORRECT reservoir and see how much improvement that makes

 

[peakbagger]

If you haven't downloaded and looked at the student manual,

https://www.steelsoldiers.com/showt...cavator-flu-419-manuals-and-a-student-handout

there are several drawings of the hydraulics for the front end loader. starting at Page 37. Note these only cover the Front end loader not the backhoe despite terms that seem to apply to the backhoe.


Generally not good to run a positive displacement pump empty as it gets its lubrication from the fluid its pumping.

 

[SeeNebraska]

well that made a world of difference. I did have a lot of the manuals downloaded but there is a lot of info to cover and i had a handwritten note from the previous owner that was a lot easier to read. It never occurred to me that the letter would have completely false info in it!

 

[peakbagger]

I thank the day that someone had the courtesy to upload that student handbook to this forum. Those diagrams are worth 100s of pages of the official manuals. I swear some contractor got paid per page to crank out the official military versions. If you are up for more light reading, there are tech tips made for the military mechanics in a cartoon form. I cut and pasted them in a PDF book and its stored away on the same MISC TM forum.

 

[SeeNebraska]

i agree, that student manual is much easier to digest.