increasing reliability and offroad performance

[army70deuce]

Gentlemen,
First off I'm in Baghdad so don't have access to my deuce to check my theories so I'm hoping to get some good numbers. Plan on working on the deuce when I get back in 2011.

My goal is to increase reliability and offroad performance through relocation of sensative equipment. My first idea is to move the batterybox(and toolbox on opposite side) to the bed and replace the side step with a fold down step, thus increasing the ground clearance directly under the cab(less chance of highcentering) I will also relocate the spare tire to the bed. Here's where it gets tricky I think that I can rotate the gas tank 90 degrees and raise it right up to the bottom of the bed, which should get it higher off the ground and away from rocks and stumps. To fill it I will put a filler hose that goes from the top of tank through the bed and curve to the side of the bed rail so it fills more like any normal truck/SUV. I will attach a picture with some markings. Obviously the back 2ft of bed will be made into tool/tire/battery/gas hose protection/storage box.

What problems do you see with this and how much extra ground clearance under the cab back to the first rear axle do you think I can get. Also any additional recommendations of things to move or areas to protect would be appreciated.

 

[markmontana]

Wow- you must really be driving your truck in some rough areas. I thought we had some rugged terrain out here in Utah/Idaho/Nevada. Never felt like the deuce was weak in the areas you point out.

Max out the tire size on your truck and you will have a hard time high centering or damaging steps.

I would say- drive her as is, and if you do some damage- then you can fix per your project ideas- and you will know exactly what your weak points are.

 

[gimpyrobb]

Unfortunately, bigger tires does not save the running boards. I do like the idea of re-locating the batterys and removing the "under driver tool box", but the fuel tank is situated past the front of the bed, so moving it up will not really work. I'd jam that into the bed too. Better yet, make a tank that will fit between the bed and the frame. You will have to tell them(whoever makes it) that it will be a hydraulic tank as almost no-one will make that custom fuel tank.

 

[maddawg308]

Someone here on the site built a serious mudbogger out of a deuce, here's the pic to give you ideas.

If you're just doing some minor offroading, leave the deuce as is, and fix as needed. However, if the Rubicon Trail is too sissy for you, I'd bob the deuce, hack off the mud flaps, fenders, and bed. Relocate the batteries and fuel tank to where the bed was. Eliminate the tool box on the driver's side altogether. Put big tires on it, like 395/85R20s or so, and you might have to re-route the exhaust pipe since the fenders are gone. Then you'll have a serious off-road machine that won't get hung up on anything you try and conquer.

 

[cranetruck]

If you are concerned about damage from highcentering, add one or more skid plates.
Moving things higher will move the CG higher as well and make the truck less able to handle side slopes (as will taller tires).

More complexity = less reliability

I am in agreement with you on wanting to tinker with the deuce, it's like a large erector set project and I'm guilty of doing same, however now and then I go back and remove "features" that are not terribly practical.

 

[jesusgatos]

I like the idea of eliminating the running boards, boxes, and fuel tank under the cab. I would have done that on Mah Deuce, but storage space is at a premium (motorhome conversion). It would be very easy to build a long, narrow fuel tank that would fit between the framerails and the bottom of the bed. There's a LOT of unused space there. If you want to keep the stock tank, don't flip it on it's side (think about the problems that would create with the fuel pump & fuel level sending unit) - just raise it up higher. There's plenty of room. Making those changes will improve your break-over angle and increase your ground clearance right where you really want/need it.

 

[stumps]

Looking at the bobbed deuce in Maddawg's picture shows me the mechanic that made it has a distorted sense of priorities. When you shorten the wheelbase, put on monster tires, and take the resulting truck-a-sore-ass into the rough to go hill climbing, stump jumping, mud bogging, or rock climbing, you increase the likelihood that it will roll over.... something the deuce does with usually fatal results for the occupants.

Don't start off worrying about over centering, worry about rolling. The first modification you should consider if you are going to go "extreme deuceing" is a mechanically robust roll over protection system (ROPS).

-Chuck

 

[Unforgiven]

Get a step tank (fuel) from another type of truck. Replace the tool box under the driver's door with the step tank. Leave the battery box where it is, just fabricate some rock sliders under it. Add tag(pusher)-type axle hubs on each side, one where the spare tire was & the other where the fuel tank was (behind the cab on both sides). Not only would this eliminate high-centering, but it would allow you to carry two full-sized spares (assuming you use compatible hubs). You've seen cement trucks with these raised tag hubs before. Mount them high enough to be useful off-road but avoid touching pavement so you don't have to reclassify the truck as an 8x8 with the DMV.

 

[Unforgiven]

And lose the front winch for better angle of attack. Just carry a chain come-along instead.

 

[Jakob]

And lose the front winch for better angle of attack. Just carry a chain come-along instead.

Along with the Incredible Hulk in your pocket.

 

[maddawg308]

Get something like this - big and long and wide, so the danger of flipping over is nil. Big tires to absorb the impacts, and cab-over design so you can see the trail better. Just get rid of the front stabilizing plow and the rear outriggers, and you'll have great clearance.

 

[exbrown]

I see on your paper that you may be interested in removing your troop seats.
If you are interested in selling them, I would be interested.

 

[eldgenb]

I would relocate the batteries to under the bench in the cab, get a fuel tank from a chevy blazer, they are a low hung between the rails fuel tank that holds 18 gallons or so and carry a couple jerry cans for long trips or mount two blazer tanks. Get some 395-85-r20 for increased performance and clearance, add a muffler forget about the air shutoff, get a el cheapo manual crane or cherry picker to mount in the bed because any tire you go with is heavy. That about sums it up.

 

[Unforgiven]

Along with the Incredible Hulk in your pocket.

The wonders of snatch blocks and pulleys

 

[Recovry4x4]

Moving the tool box and batteries will prevent damage to them but will do little to prevent high centering. Once those are out of the way you will have a clear view of the huge hulking transfer case hanging at about the same level as the boxes you removed.

 

[army70deuce]

I believe my description of the tank move might have been misread, I'm not trying to turn it sideways, I'm thinking that I could rotate it 90 degrees so the back of the tank is at the fram rails and the front of the tank is lined up with the side of the bed and raise it up as close as possible. Does anyone know the dimentions of the tank and the distance between the frame and the side of the bed.

Thanks.

 

[Unforgiven]

It won't fit that way. The tank is 40" long. There's only about 30" from the frame to the side of the bed.

I'm telling you. Buy a 50 gallon rectangular step tank from an International or older Ford. Replace the tool box with a step tank. They come in a wide choice of sizes.

I've already bought two of them off of heavytruckparts.net for this exact purpose. The passenger battery box and driver tool box are being replaced with these step tanks when I do my crew cab.

Mount spare tire tag hubs to prevent high centering. Recovery is right. The transfer case sits WAYYY low under the frame rails. Moving the tank will not prevent high-centering.

You can have custom tanks welded up to whatever dimension you want if you decide to put it high between the frame and side of bed.

 

[saddamsnightmare]

May 6th, 2010.

Why mess up a perfectly good deuce when what you REALLY want is a Unimog? An S404,406,408 or U1300L will beat any deuce in off road work..... flat out! Particularly since you don't plan to haul 2-1/2 tons along with you, but I believe the U1300L might just be able to do that too.....

Just my experienced two cents worth.....

 

[jesusgatos]

I like the steptank idea. Been thinking about using those on Mah Deuce. How large are those tanks, typically? Are the dimensions anything standard?

But I don't agree with your comment about increasing ground clearance under the rocker panels. Who cares if the transfercase is the lowest point? Increasing ground clearance ANYWHERE is never a bad thing, and improving ground clearance under the rockers is probably only second to anything that affects your approach/departure angle. Maybe even more important, depending on the vehicle. It's OK if you can't increase ground clearance in towards the center of the chassis. Increasing ground clearance under the rockers, outside the framerails, is still going to be a huge improvement. What you're essentially doing is creating a V-shaped hull, sort of like the newer military trucks that are designed to survive IED blasts. Google 'boatside rockers' and take a look at how rock crawlers are modifying their vehicles in a similar manner.

 

[jesusgatos]

May 6th, 2010.

Why mess up a perfectly good deuce when what you REALLY want is a Unimog? An S404,406,408 or U1300L will beat any deuce in off road work..... flat out! Particularly since you don't plan to haul 2-1/2 tons along with you, but I believe the U1300L might just be able to do that too.....

Just my experienced two cents worth.....

A purpose-built Deuce 'buggy' would GET DOWN. Always wanted to see one built. Never enough to build one myself.