Issues Starting MEP-005

[hrbergeron]

I have an issue where my MEP-005 will not start.

Backstory: Generator ran fine up until around 3 weeks ago when I accidentally ran it out of fuel. Since then after refilling the tank with fuel, the generator will not start. I am getting fuel to the injectors and smoke from the exhaust, but the engine will not start.

Here is what I have checked/performed (after refilling with diesel):
Day tank is full and fuel pumps are ticking like they should.
Main tank is mostly full of diesel
Checked and cleaned the return line check valve at the top of the IP, it was already clean and working right.
I am getting fuel to the injectors and smoke from the exhaust, but the engine will not start.
I've tried cracking injectors and return lines with no success other than diesel coming out.
Throttle is pulled all the way out.
Engine will try to kick with starting fluid but will not run.
All fault lights are working and none illuminate when cranking, and only the low oil pressure illuminates before and after (obviously because the engine isn't on)
Batteries are fully charged and when I am cranking it is slaved to my HMMWV.

I really need this generator working on Sunday. I have a spare mep-005 that I may have to mount in it's place if I can not get this one to work.

Thanks in advance

 

[Guyfang]

You can not get fuel to the Cylinders and smoke at the exhaust, and it not start if there is compression. It ran before, so I would assume it has compression.

Have you checked at the L1, (solenoid on top of the IP) for 24 VDC?

 

[DieselAddict]

Have you tried the WD40 starting trick?

 

[Ray70]

Also, is your shut-off lever wired back towards the rear of the IP? If not, make sure it hasn't rotated clockwise towards the radiator at all.
Lastly, smoke without start could be an indication of insufficent fuel. Diesels go to full throttle at start-up and the governor grings teh fuel down as soon as it starts to build RPM. In my experience, the IP on the 005 can get a bit air bound inside the body ( which needs to be full of fuel to operate correctly.
You can loosen or remove the top cover and verify the body if full right to the top with fuel. If it isn't you can just fill if while the cover is off.
While you are in there you should probably make sure the glass check ball in the short 1/8" NPT pipe under the T-fitting in the top cover is free to move. If it is sticky that could lead to low or too little fuel flow to the injectors.

 

[jmenende]

Did you try resetting the speed switch button?

 

[Ray70]

Speed switch button?? 005A? I believe you're thinking of the 805A...

 

[jmenende]

Speed switch button?? 005A? I believe you're thinking of the 805A...

Nope, the 005a has a speed switch. Actually pressed it myself today while working on one. Looking at the genset from the front it is located behind the back door on left hand side. It pops out vertically from the engine block and has a canon plug on the top. Where the plug connects there is a small rubber button you can press to reset.

 

[hrbergeron]

You can not get fuel to the Cylinders and smoke at the exhaust, and it not start if there is compression.

Have you checked at the L1, (solenoid on top of the IP) for 24 VDC?

Well I have fuel to all cylinders and smoke blowing out the exhaust, so...
And the fuel shut off solenoid is getting 24v and working correctly.

Speed switch button?? 005A? I believe you're thinking of the 805A...

There's an overspeed sensor on a mep005... near where the oil dipstick is. This one is actually recently new and is working.

Also, is your shut-off lever wired back towards the rear of the IP?

Yes, it is wired all the way back and has not moved.

While you are in there you should probably make sure the glass check ball in the short 1/8" NPT pipe under the T-fitting in the top cover is free to move. If it is sticky that could lead to low or too little fuel flow to the injectors.

Already did, as mentioned in my original post and was clean when removed with no chunks of anything in it (amazing!). The fuel is also full in the IP up to the point where the check valve is.

 

[Guyfang]

Ray70 said:

Speed switch button?? 005A? I believe you're thinking of the 805A...

There's an overspeed sensor on a mep005... near where the oil dipstick is. This one is actually recently new and is working.

You are assuming. Testing is always better. The voltage for L1 comes through S9-3, (Speed Switch) contacts. The path is, S7-9 to TB101-9, wire #P47G. From there to the S/P Relay box, (Special relay box) wire P47F to J5, pin N and back out on P5 wire #P47J to the S9-3.

Ok, You have 24 VDC to the L1. Is the other side of L1 connected to ground? I helped someone about a year ago, who had just that problem. So take a wire and go from the - side of the L1 and ground it. Should be wire #P55X. Then try and start. When trying to start, lets say running the starter 30 seconds, do you have the 24 volts the whole time?

 

[Guyfang]

I posted this in the wrong thread. So here it is now.

Diesel engine starting = air / fuel / compression
air restricted?
fuel restricted?
compression issue?
Three things to think about.

It ran until you ran it out of fuel. So its hard to conceive its restricted air. That leaves the last two. So I will repeat again. It ran until you ran it out of fuel. Compression would not seem to be the problem.

Fuel. That would seem to be the way I would start looking. Which is why I have been telling you to check the electrical problem. If L1 will not work, and stay energized during the whole starting process, then it wont start. When you determine that it cant be that, then its time to start looking at fuel, and from that I mean from the day tank to the injector. This gen set is notaries for being a hard one to bleed air from the system.

Have you done anything else to it since it run out of fuel?.

The FL1/FL2 should have shut the set off before it ran dry in the fuel system, daytank to injector. If it was ran dry, the daytank float didnt work, or you ran in in battle short mode.

 

[hrbergeron]

Turned out air was still in the lines. I had a helper crank the engine while I cracked the injectors until it finally started. Now it's running correctly. What a pain to bleed, HMMWVs are so much easier.

Since the phrase goes "two is one and one is none" I'm going to work on my other 005 soon just in case this current one dies (6000 hours on it currently) I'll have the other ready to go. Now that one I know for certain has a bad overspeed sensor and I need a new one.

 

[Guyfang]

Turned out air was still in the lines. I had a helper crank the engine while I cracked the injectors until it finally started. Now it's running correctly. What a pain to bleed, HMMWVs are so much easier.

Since the phrase goes "two is one and one is none" I'm going to work on my other 005 soon just in case this current one dies (6000 hours on it currently) I'll have the other ready to go. Now that one I know for certain has a bad overspeed sensor and I need a new one.

Like I wrote, this set is notorious for bleeding air is out of the fuel delivery system. Which is why I wrote:
The FL1/FL2 should have shut the set off before it ran dry in the fuel system, daytank to injector. If it was ran dry, the daytank float didn't work, or you ran in in battle short mode.

I would guess a big part of the problem was because: I've tried cracking injectors and return lines with no success other than diesel coming out.

You had all the lines open and fuel drained back, air in. Over the years we discovered that the best way to bleed the system, was to simply crack the #6 injector line, and turn the engine over. Nothing more. Any time we fooled with the rest of the lines, we let in more air then fuel was pumped out. Normally, when the FL1 /Fl2 switch shuts the set down for low fuel, (you never mentioned if that indeed happened) the system stays primed. If the system ran dry, you need to look at the float. Test it IAW the TM.

6000 hours is barely broke in.

The S9 is an Overspeed Switch, not a sensor. Whats wrong with the S9? Is is a mech or elect. S9? Sometimes they can be fixed.

 

[hrbergeron]

The FL1/FL2 should have shut the set off before it ran dry in the fuel system, daytank to injector. If it was ran dry, the daytank float didn't work, or you ran in in battle short mode.

Yep, when I pulled the day tank apart to check for blockages and refill with diesel, the float was broken in two.

You had all the lines open and fuel drained back, air in. Over the years we discovered that the best way to bleed the system, was to simply crack the #6 injector line, and turn the engine over.

Well I wanted to check if any of the injector lines were clogged, so there's really only one way to find out.

6000 hours is barely broke in.

Tell that to my headgasket

The S9 is an Overspeed Switch, not a sensor.

Arguing over semantics.

 

[Guyfang]

Guyfang said: The S9 is an Overspeed Switch, not a sensor.


Arguing over semantics.

Yep. But not meant to be ugly. Just simpler for my old brain to keep track of things.

Have you looked for a new FL1/FL2 yet? thre are at least two different kinds, and at least a handful NSN's and Part #'s.

Guyfang said: 6000 hours is barely broke in.

Tell that to my head gasket

When you get the gasket kit, get the kit with the oil pan gaskets in it. Cheap insurance. Front and rear main seals tight?