MaverickH1
Member
- 345
- 6
- 18
- Location
- Roanoke, VA
Okay... so I'm hoping the mods understand this is a different topic than other M998/M1038 HMMWV threads because I will discuss titling... I messaged Warthog and got no response, and I just received another PM question about an M1123 from another gentleman in VA.
The goal of this thread is to help alleviate some of the anxiety that might be felt when buying one of these trucks. Hopefully if someone Googles "M1123" when they're thinking of buying one, this thread will be where they land.
Background:
The M1123 trucks being sold on GovPlanet are sold under a different contract than the typical M998 and M1038 trucks. For comparison, the M998/M1038 trucks number about 4500 trucks sold on GovPlanet. The M1123 trucks have sold... 10? This is not an accurate number because it is possible for the truck auctions to be privatized after completion. There are many more being auctioned off now.
Every M998 and M1038 is sold with the ever famous "Off Road Use Only" restriction. There are the rare ones that were sold before GovPlanet that don't have the restriction. There are private auctions on GovPlanet every now and then that don't have the restriction NOW but did have it when the truck was initially sold. It would be impossible for me in VA to buy a military contracted sale M998/M1038 from GovPlanet and title/register it. We are not talking about those trucks or anything related to them. Those trucks (as I understand it), are former Army and supposedly some Air Force trucks.
The M1123 trucks are former Marine Corps vehicles. It was about 4 months ago that I realized the M1123 trucks did NOT show "OFF ROAD USE ONLY" in the Notices and Restrictions portion of the GovPlanet auction. Upon further questions, I was informed by GovPlanet that these trucks would actually come with a CLEAN SF97 (also specified in the auction) and that they did not have the Off Road Use Only restriction. In fact, I was promised a clear Georgia title.
I called the VA DMV, and they confirmed that what I was saying was true. They looked at Virginia Code and verified that the Humvee was not named or similar in spirit to the definition of "Off Road Vehicle" in the state of VA as well. Therefore the only thing restricting the road legal use of a Humvee was the "Off Road Use Only" restriction on other Humvees.
Purchase
My bid for the M1123 did not meet the reserve. I was called after the auction ended and talked to the customer service rep and I ended up deciding to sell some other things in my life to meet the reserve. We agreed and he removed the auction from public viewing. I can still see it in my BUYING section on GovPlanet. When I went to the CHECKOUT area, the only options for paperwork were a Bill of Sale or an SF97. Since I needed a GA title, I called GovPlanet again and was assured I would get one and that I could pay for it later, so I wired the Invoice amount to GovPlanet.
Fees - You will have your purchase price. Plus the 10% transaction fee. Plus GA state tax. Plus the local GA county sales tax. In my case, there might also be Virginia sales tax. I'm not sure at the moment.
Then came the End Use Certificate. Submitted on 8/17, pending 8/23, currently waiting to see when it will be approved. As of this writing I am just past week 8. See the EUC approval thread.
I stopped by my VA DMV to get my old motorcycle back on the road and started inquiring about the Humvee situation, as we all know a phone call to the DMV headquarters in Richmond will get different answers than a visit to the local DMV. I was informed that there would be no special process for getting it registered. The VIN would be decided by what's on the Georgia title, which I expect will be something like the 6 digit serial number. In any case, they made it sound like it wasn't a big deal at all.
So it looks like I'm just waiting for the EUC to clear... and then for GovPlanet to send me the title (which should take a month), titling/registering the M1123 and then starting the process for it to pass VA inspection. I have already called the Albany, GA location to see if there's anything I should do in preparation for pick-up, and they simply recommended that I call them ahead of time and they'll pull the Humvee around to the front when I get there.
Something to note... if you call someone at GovPlanet, they might have no idea that the M1123 trucks exist as a separate entity to the other M998/M1038 trucks. It is a small, small fraction of what they are used to. I got so many canned responses of "Sir, the Humvees only sell with an off-road use restriction" and I had to spend a bit of time on the phone with some of the agents and show them auction numbers and prove I was talking about something different. I was put on hold several times while they talked to someone higher up and usually came back with an apology. Be patient. These are rare-ish birds. They receive questions from people alllll dayyyy about Off Road Use Only Humvees.
It's a bit nerve racking to throw several thousand dollars into a bucket, then wait 3-4 months for the EUC to clear and get few answers about whether you can even drive the thing on the road with both the DMV and GovPlanet giving vague answers and refusing to put any definitive answers in written word so you can show them to someone later. I actually just audio recorded my conversation at the DMV for this reason.
-------
If this thread is allowed to exist... I'll add a section about what it took to get it to pass VA inspection in my emissions free locality, and details about picking the truck up and anything else that pops up... as well as my build updates as time goes on.
The goal of this thread is to help alleviate some of the anxiety that might be felt when buying one of these trucks. Hopefully if someone Googles "M1123" when they're thinking of buying one, this thread will be where they land.
Background:
The M1123 trucks being sold on GovPlanet are sold under a different contract than the typical M998 and M1038 trucks. For comparison, the M998/M1038 trucks number about 4500 trucks sold on GovPlanet. The M1123 trucks have sold... 10? This is not an accurate number because it is possible for the truck auctions to be privatized after completion. There are many more being auctioned off now.
Every M998 and M1038 is sold with the ever famous "Off Road Use Only" restriction. There are the rare ones that were sold before GovPlanet that don't have the restriction. There are private auctions on GovPlanet every now and then that don't have the restriction NOW but did have it when the truck was initially sold. It would be impossible for me in VA to buy a military contracted sale M998/M1038 from GovPlanet and title/register it. We are not talking about those trucks or anything related to them. Those trucks (as I understand it), are former Army and supposedly some Air Force trucks.
The M1123 trucks are former Marine Corps vehicles. It was about 4 months ago that I realized the M1123 trucks did NOT show "OFF ROAD USE ONLY" in the Notices and Restrictions portion of the GovPlanet auction. Upon further questions, I was informed by GovPlanet that these trucks would actually come with a CLEAN SF97 (also specified in the auction) and that they did not have the Off Road Use Only restriction. In fact, I was promised a clear Georgia title.
I called the VA DMV, and they confirmed that what I was saying was true. They looked at Virginia Code and verified that the Humvee was not named or similar in spirit to the definition of "Off Road Vehicle" in the state of VA as well. Therefore the only thing restricting the road legal use of a Humvee was the "Off Road Use Only" restriction on other Humvees.
Purchase
My bid for the M1123 did not meet the reserve. I was called after the auction ended and talked to the customer service rep and I ended up deciding to sell some other things in my life to meet the reserve. We agreed and he removed the auction from public viewing. I can still see it in my BUYING section on GovPlanet. When I went to the CHECKOUT area, the only options for paperwork were a Bill of Sale or an SF97. Since I needed a GA title, I called GovPlanet again and was assured I would get one and that I could pay for it later, so I wired the Invoice amount to GovPlanet.
Fees - You will have your purchase price. Plus the 10% transaction fee. Plus GA state tax. Plus the local GA county sales tax. In my case, there might also be Virginia sales tax. I'm not sure at the moment.
Then came the End Use Certificate. Submitted on 8/17, pending 8/23, currently waiting to see when it will be approved. As of this writing I am just past week 8. See the EUC approval thread.
I stopped by my VA DMV to get my old motorcycle back on the road and started inquiring about the Humvee situation, as we all know a phone call to the DMV headquarters in Richmond will get different answers than a visit to the local DMV. I was informed that there would be no special process for getting it registered. The VIN would be decided by what's on the Georgia title, which I expect will be something like the 6 digit serial number. In any case, they made it sound like it wasn't a big deal at all.
So it looks like I'm just waiting for the EUC to clear... and then for GovPlanet to send me the title (which should take a month), titling/registering the M1123 and then starting the process for it to pass VA inspection. I have already called the Albany, GA location to see if there's anything I should do in preparation for pick-up, and they simply recommended that I call them ahead of time and they'll pull the Humvee around to the front when I get there.
Something to note... if you call someone at GovPlanet, they might have no idea that the M1123 trucks exist as a separate entity to the other M998/M1038 trucks. It is a small, small fraction of what they are used to. I got so many canned responses of "Sir, the Humvees only sell with an off-road use restriction" and I had to spend a bit of time on the phone with some of the agents and show them auction numbers and prove I was talking about something different. I was put on hold several times while they talked to someone higher up and usually came back with an apology. Be patient. These are rare-ish birds. They receive questions from people alllll dayyyy about Off Road Use Only Humvees.
It's a bit nerve racking to throw several thousand dollars into a bucket, then wait 3-4 months for the EUC to clear and get few answers about whether you can even drive the thing on the road with both the DMV and GovPlanet giving vague answers and refusing to put any definitive answers in written word so you can show them to someone later. I actually just audio recorded my conversation at the DMV for this reason.
-------
If this thread is allowed to exist... I'll add a section about what it took to get it to pass VA inspection in my emissions free locality, and details about picking the truck up and anything else that pops up... as well as my build updates as time goes on.
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