Sephirothq
Well-known member
- 1,423
- 26
- 48
- Location
- Trevorton / PA
I was just going to comment on the same thing. I have my test on Friday this week for my M923. YOu can't drive them with just a class C.
I have now spent countless hours chasing this down, including going to PennDOT license center in Bensalem and talking to pretty much everyone there. Per Joe at Bensalem PennDOT -- one of the guys that conducts CDL tests, I had to get a CDL b/c the 5 ton has airbrakes. His colleague, Tom, bought into my story line, which is 5 ton is exempt b/c it's antique and does not qualify as commercial vehicle. They went to supervisor, who professed ignorance. One of these guys had son in military, so they took some pity on me and my desperate quest to really make sure I'm legal. Joe called me a few days later (unheard of service for PennDOT, huh!) and said he called Harrisburg and this is the DEFINITIVE ANSWER:
1) You do NOT need CDL
2) You DO need to change the regular PA Class C license to a CLASS B (NON CDL) license - b/c the 5 ton DOES exceed 26K GVWR. Class B NON CDL lets you drive a NON commercial vehicle (e.g. antique 5 ton or large motor home) weighing above 26K CDL.
3) You do NOT need a "knowledge test" (where you take a test and answer questions) to get the Class B, but do need a driving test with your vehicle.
4) You DO need separate air brake test/endorsement on license, again b/c 5 ton has AIR BRAKES.
Joe issued me a learners permit for a Class B for $5. He told me to come back to take a driving test for the airbrake endorsement, "when you are ready" -- but within a year of getting the learner's permit. At the driving test, he said he'll want to make sure I know basics for airbrakes, like "what happens when you run out of air." He suggested I read up on the air brakes part in CDL book -- let's face it guys, if you got through 8th grade, you can pass the test on air brakes!
I will wind up getting the Class B, for two simple reasons. First, even though most local cops won't bother you at all, there is a chance you might get pulled over elsewhere (post 9-11 they all fear some Rambo Jihadi and they might pull you over just for that). So I want to be able to show the cop my class B that says I'm legal to drive > 26K GVWR and not have any issues. Worse, many enforcement officers assume (as did Joe initially) that airbrakes automatically invokes CDL, so having a Class B NON CDL license with airbrake endorsement, is 100% defense against this argument. Otherwise, you are left there trying to convince the officer that an antique offers you exemption against BOTH GVWR and airbrakes... do you really want an interpretational debate on the side of the road -- remember most these guys aren't used to and very much resent being told they are wrong -- and the downside is they simply tow your truck ($$$) and maybe give a few tickets to boot.
The second reason I am going to get Class B NON CDL w/airbrake endorsement is god forbid I hit someone in this monster, imagine the field day their lawyer will have suing me... so you drove a truck exceeding your rated license and you lacked the proper certification for stopping it!!! And now my client's neck hurts!!! I rather be absolutely 100% legal!
As far as LEO ignoring antiques, I don't know what kind of courtesy they show, but they typically won't know it's antique until after they pull you over. And they are so hungry for revenue, unless you are dealing w/someone who is former military, they might just throw you in their meat grinder. I've gotten 3 tickets once while driving a brand new pick up truck w/my kids coming back from Home Depot!! They made me go to some inspection station and said I had too much weight on my rear axle, the straps I was using to tie my purchases weren't DOT approved and some other crap. When I told the guy I was a homeowner and had no clue about this, he said "that's what all you contractors say." Only when I went to Court and showed up in my suit from day job, he said he remembered me and agreed to drop the tix w/o my even going in front of a judge. As I said, it's a revenue thing and who needs to risk huge tow bill and tickets when for a bit of hassle and $5 or so in license fee, you can avoid even the most fiendish enforcement vampires.
FWIW, I registered my truck as antique b/c of the savings. The registration says "Title Brands: Antique Vehicle" It does NOT show GVWR, but it does show "unladen weight" 21,550". Per PennDOT, it is NOT unladen weight that invokes CDL, it's GVWR. And the forms I filled out when registering definitely had GVWR on them, so I assume LEO can see it on their screen when they pull you over. Even if they can't see GVWR on their system, they can see it on the plate inside truck.... (I was thinking of strategies to show it's non CDL by arguing it's under 26K GVWR, but this is so easily disproven, it's not worth the risk LEO will peg you as trying to fool him)
Sorry for the long post, just wanted to share my learnings.