Survival 109 build

[m715mike]

QUADJEEPER had already rebuilt all of his brake cylinders less than a year ago....see post #7...seems to me he went looking for trouble and the M109 slapped him.

Sounds to me like QUADJEEPER and RAYZER can slap harder!

QUADJEEPER - Keep up the amazing work Sir! You are truly talented! Discouragement will come and go. The fact of the matter is that you will have an awesome rig to enjoy for a long time to come!

 

[Another Ahab]

Sounds to me like QUADJEEPER and RAYZER can slap harder!

QUADJEEPER - Keep up the amazing work Sir! You are truly talented! Discouragement will come and go. The fact of the matter is that you will have an awesome rig to enjoy for a long time to come![/QUOTE]

Yeah, for what it's worth there are more than a few of us behind you in this, and though we're not much help to you, we are pulling for you 100%!

 

[QUADJEEPER]

I had a similar problem with the studs on my rear axles. Cut them off with a torch and replaced all my studs with RH thread. No issues since

The right hand ones were the issue. Should I switch to all left hand ones?

 

[QUADJEEPER]

Thanks everyone. I do appreciate the support.

 

[Another Ahab]

I had a similar problem with the studs on my rear axles. Cut them off with a torch and replaced all my studs with RH thread. No issues since

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

 

[red]

The right hand ones were the issue. Should I switch to all left hand ones?

Maybe? Haha. I went all RH thread on mine for simplicity and I was doing the hub flip so I needed new studs anyways.

 

[red]

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

Heard that before, but if it was true then the vast majority of vehicles on the road would be losing lug nuts on the driver side since very few run LH threads.

 

[5ivepenny]

RH and LH thread

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

Not a historian but have a story that follows this thought process I can share. I had a 49 Pontiac Silverstreak when I was a teenager because I thought the old led sleds where cool (still do, just cant afford any toys that don't serve a purpose now) and the right side of the car had LH thread and left had regular RH thread studs so being the curious kid that I was I asked around and an older gentleman machinist told me that back in the day the engineers thought the rotational force of the wheels would loosen up the lug nuts. This proved not to be true over time, with correct torque so modern vehicles have done away with the opposing threads as it was a bigger issue to have broken wheel studs from inexperienced mechanics not paying attention to the "L" stamped on the end of the stud. Not sure if this is the real reason behind it but I found it interesting none the less. -cheers

Just to clear up because visualizing RH and LH can be confusing to some: the mechanical world uses RH thread most of the time this is "regular thread" you have to turn it to the right to tighten it. LH hand thread is the goofy one and you have to turn to the Left to tighten. Some people think of the direction as you loosen but the industry goes by how you tighten. That is why the engineers thought a lug nut on the right side of the car would be better with LH thread because as the wheel turned to the right going forward the circular forces against the lug nut would be turning the opposite way (Left) thus keeping the lug nuts with LH thread on the right side of the car tight. The L stamped on the end of the stud is to tell you it has LH thread (turn left to tighten) thus you would turn right to loosen. A little confusing because most people are always think of the direction to loosen as we start by taking things apart first not putting it together for the first time like the engineers did.

Now to confuse even more, this is how it was with my Pontiac, but my deuce is the exact opposite the goofy studs (LH) are all on the drivers side and the regular ones are on the passenger side.....I wish I knew the whole story!!

 

[QUADJEEPER]

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

When I first started with Chrysler as a tech, many of the cars had left hand threads on the left side. Was advertised at the time as a safety feature. I guess now we don't need safe wheel retention on the left side of modern cars. (?)

 

[rustystud]

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

I posted it a while back. The bottom line is there is a "directional torque". It is not a myth or fable. So since the deuce only uses 6 lug nuts they felt it would be safer to make the right side reverse rotation. The industry changed this though since to many people where breaking the studs! So in todays big trucks, they all use 10 lug nuts. You will be hard pressed to find anything else. Some medium trucks use less then 10 lug nuts but they are using "special" nuts. In my experience I have found that the right side of a truck or bus will have the most loose lug nuts. Now the industry has gone to these little plastic "flags" or "pointers" that will let you know that a lug nut has come loose.

 

[KaiserM109]

You know I'm thinking I heard somewhere that there is a safety reason behind the reverse-threads, something to do with loosening by rotation.

Anybody know the story (IF there is one)?

As M37 owners probably know, the brake drums (which include the studs) are interchangeable front-to-back. My M37 in 1/11th Artillery had them switched around so that both front wheels had right hand threads and both rear wheels had left had threads. What do you suppose that did to safety in a hard stop? Also do you suppose an M37 with its wheels locked would have an issue with loosing a nut?

I too am halting work on my M109 as an off-road camper.

With regard to the transmission, the deuce was originally set up for a gasoline engine which could turn 3500 RPMs easily. To put a diesel that could only turn 2200 in them without going to different axle ratios, they put in an overdrive transmission. That's why it has such a strange shift pattern. What used to be 5th gear is straight through. They took what used to be 4th gear and changed it to a ratio of less than 1 to 1, making in an overdrive. What they didn't do was beef up the transmission.

This is what makes re-powering a deuce difficult. If you put in a different engine, you have to use the transmission and clutch that match it. A diesel that is limited to 2200 RPM will only push that deuce at about 40 MPH because of the axle ratios. Don't believe that? Drive your deuce in 4th gear, which is straight through. Going to a gasoline engine that can rap up to 3500 RPM might be a workable combination.

The overriding issue is the weak engine, a non-turbo LD-465-1 and the difficulty of replacing it. I bought an M923A1, but there are issues there, too, but the major components are civilian and not so hard to find. I am pushing ahead with the M923 and am planning on putting the box off of the M109 on it, after bobbing it.

I admire you guys that will take the time and effort to fix up a 45 yr. old truck, but I'm just not sure that my '66 Kaiser-Jeep truck will ever be trustworthy enough to take way back in the woods, even if I get a better engine in it. A couple of years ago it cost me $375 to have my M923 and the M101 trailer it was towing hauled 16 miles, and that was from a Walmart parking lot.

 

[5ivepenny]

added some info to my post 2 or 3 posts back about LH and RH thread the way I have always understood it in my automotive experience, but I notice the rules seem to be opposite for my Deuce?? what gives?

p.s. "Quadjeeper" don't let the challenges beat you down. As a few others have already said, many projects have a dark moment in them when the end seems so far away. I have been there myself and always regret quitting more than pushing forward. Your build looks cool! And I have gotten some motivation and ideas from reading your post's. Thanks!!

 

[Another Ahab]

As M37 owners probably know, the brake drums (which include the studs) are interchangeable front-to-back. My M37 in 1/11th Artillery had them switched around so that both front wheels had right hand threads and both rear wheels had left had threads. What do you suppose that did to safety in a hard stop? Also do you suppose an M37 with its wheels locked would have an issue with loosing a nut?

That sounds like a mechanics nightmare. I can just picture the streak of colorful language coming from somebody trying to service those wheels.

 

[red]

That sounds like a mechanics nightmare. I can just picture the streak of colorful language coming from somebody trying to service those wheels.

Almost as bad as a 53' flatbed trailer I was overhauling today. Sitting for a few years with locked up air brakes. Had to heat the lug nuts up till they were glowing before the 1" impact gun could buzz em off.

 

[rustystud]

Almost as bad as a 53' flatbed trailer I was overhauling today. Sitting for a few years with locked up air brakes. Had to heat the lug nuts up till they were glowing before the 1" impact gun could buzz em off.

Been there, bought the "T" shirt ! That is why I always recommend that people use "anti-sieze" on their stud threads. Not only will it help prevent "galling" the threads but it will help it from rusting. Like I have said many times before, the bus and heavy truck industry now recommends that all stud threads be lubricated. Some manufactures want you to use "their" special lube, but anti-sieze is just fine.

 

[rustystud]

Not a historian but have a story that follows this thought process I can share. I had a 49 Pontiac Silverstreak when I was a teenager because I thought the old led sleds where cool (still do, just cant afford any toys that don't serve a purpose now) and the right side of the car had LH thread and left had regular RH thread studs so being the curious kid that I was I asked around and an older gentleman machinist told me that back in the day the engineers thought the rotational force of the wheels would loosen up the lug nuts. This proved not to be true over time, with correct torque so modern vehicles have done away with the opposing threads as it was a bigger issue to have broken wheel studs from inexperienced mechanics not paying attention to the "L" stamped on the end of the stud. Not sure if this is the real reason behind it but I found it interesting none the less. -cheers

Just to clear up because visualizing RH and LH can be confusing to some: the mechanical world uses RH thread most of the time this is "regular thread" you have to turn it to the right to tighten it. LH hand thread is the goofy one and you have to turn to the Left to tighten. Some people think of the direction as you loosen but the industry goes by how you tighten. That is why the engineers thought a lug nut on the right side of the car would be better with LH thread because as the wheel turned to the right going forward the circular forces against the lug nut would be turning the opposite way (Left) thus keeping the lug nuts with LH thread on the right side of the car tight. The L stamped on the end of the stud is to tell you it has LH thread (turn left to tighten) thus you would turn right to loosen. A little confusing because most people are always think of the direction to loosen as we start by taking things apart first not putting it together for the first time like the engineers did.

Now to confuse even more, this is how it was with my Pontiac, but my deuce is the exact opposite the goofy studs (LH) are all on the drivers side and the regular ones are on the passenger side.....I wish I knew the whole story!!

Somebody screwed up. The LH threads are suppose to be on the right side (passenger) of the truck. Think of it this way. To loosen the lugs turn the wrench to the front of the truck, on both sides.

 

[Katahdin]

I think RustyStud had a few too many last night...deuce LH threads are on the driver's side.

 

[rustystud]

I think RustyStud had a few too many last night...deuce LH threads are on the driver's side.

My bad ! Yes I was taking my pain pills last night . I should have said to "tighten" the lug nuts turn the wrench to the front of the truck and to "loosen" the lug nuts turn the wrench to the back of the truck.

 

[Another Ahab]

Somebody screwed up. The LH threads are suppose to be on the right side (passenger) of the truck. Think of it this way. To loosen the lugs turn the wrench to the front of the truck, on both sides.

I think RustyStud had a few too many last night...deuce LH threads are on the driver's side.

My bad ! Yes I was taking my pain pills last night . I should have said to "tighten" the lug nuts turn the wrench to the front of the truck and to "loosen" the lug nuts turn the wrench to the back of the truck.

Hey, this might be fun:

- in a few days there's a chance we hear from somebody who read Post #736, but didn't get to Post #738.

- that kind of thing has potential for comedy (I mean, you know, for us; not for them; they'll be swearing a blue streak)

Time will tell. opcorn:

 

[rustystud]

You have a very "naughty" sense of humor Ahab ! LOL !