New deuce owner seeking advice

[Jacob2027]

Damn, that was dumb. I thought I was on the "engine running to fast post". Sorry guys.

Lol no problem.

 

[njfarmer]

View attachment 797591
Used as a logging truck for many years. Toyo 10.00r20s on the back with good tread and split rims. Military 9.00r20s on the front on split rims. Need to change to the 10.00r20. Where does everyone here go for tires?

 

[njfarmer]

I bought 11.00 20's from Canadian military surplus two years ago. I bought 11 tires at $160.00 each ,plus shipping ,plus $50.00 at the border.He likes to sell on Ebay. All tires were good little wear. Much improvement in steering.

 

[SCSG-G4]

That guide is awesome. Was actually just looking for that info. I can understand wanting to get away from hardline kits. I was wondering if I could use nylon airbrake line on the brake circuit. Considering dot 5 is non corrisive and non reactive. The pressure shouldn't be above that ove the air master line I wouldn't think. Have you ever tried or considered this?

Air pressure should be under 120 psi, brake fluid pressure could be over 3000. The brake boost comes from a four inch diameter air piston pushing on a .5 inch diameter brake fluid piston, about a 16 to 1 ratio. When it's not working, you have to make all the pressure with just the brake pedal. HTH.

 

[M37M35]

That guide is awesome. Was actually just looking for that info. I can understand wanting to get away from hardline kits. I was wondering if I could use nylon airbrake line on the brake circuit. Considering dot 5 is non corrisive and non reactive. The pressure shouldn't be above that ove the air master line I wouldn't think. Have you ever tried or considered this?

NO, you cannot! Nylon airbrake line is rated for around 150 PSI max. The hydraulic side of the brakes operate at around 2,000 PSI or more.

Air pressure should be under 120 psi, brake fluid pressure could be over 3000. The brake boost comes from a four inch diameter air piston pushing on a .5 inch diameter brake fluid piston, about a 16 to 1 ratio. When it's not working, you have to make all the pressure with just the brake pedal. HTH.

Like SCSG-G4 said, the brake booster uses air pressure to magnify the brake fluid pressure, increasing it many times over what the air pressure is.

 

[Jacob2027]

NO, you cannot! Nylon airbrake line is rated for around 150 PSI max. The hydraulic side of the brakes operate at around 2,000 PSI or more.




Like SCSG-G4 said, the brake booster uses air pressure to magnify the brake fluid pressure, increasing it many times over what the air pressure is.

I see. I hadn't thought about that fact. Apparently even regular hydaulic brakes have a ton of psi but it doesn't seem like it when doing pedal based bleeding... Thanks for the info.

 

[Karl kostman]

Jacob I do have one suggestion for you and that is to get a set of Technical Manuals for your truck or they can be found on this website for free! When you talking about your truck it sounds like your doing way more poking around rather haphazardly looking for some result? If you have the the TMs you will be able to research the issues, then examine how to fix them and the TMs will take you step by step through all the steps to take care of the problem. These trucks are fairly forgiving in some ways but in others you do need to know what your doing or you WILL DAMAGE something Now you may have a very big expense on your hands!!
Good luck!

 

[Mullaney]

Hi Jacob,

As far as finding the fill ports on the differentials and manual gear box - you could spend as much as a week rummaging the TM for location. My personal opinion is that who ever wrote them may never have actually even seen a MV! They are searchable as PDFs but you have to know the name of the thing you want more info about. That part can be pretty frustrating sometimes.

So, get yourself a big piece of cardboard or two and slide them under the truck. That will make it easy to slide in under and scoot around. Get comfortable. It should be relaxing to lay down there and look around. Grab a rag or two and bring your cell phone too - so you can snap pictures if you see anything that looks strange. We LOVE pictures!

Then, let's apply some logic to finding the oil level fill port (check port) problem:

1. You know for sure that the drain is on the very bottom. Gotta be that way so you can replace the oil when you get to that exercise.

2. The oil level can't be above the axles just because "that is how it is". Mostly because there is nothing but a little thin rubber seal at the end of each axle tube to keep the gear oil inside. So, around (generally just below center) you should see a plug that is about 3/4" in diameter. Some are bigger, some are smaller - but almost all will open with a half inch socket wrench on a Deuce or 5ton. Those that don't can be opened with a crescent wrench the first time - then get the right tool to put it back.

3. When you remove the plug, stick your finger in the open fill port, knuckle up and you should feel oil. It should smell like sulphur. Rub your fingers together. It should feel slick, not gritty and be dark in color. It if looks creamy and tan colored - you have water.

The picture below is a 5 Ton differential out of the TM. It is similar but different. Same rules apply to location and logic though. Gearboxes like your transmission (assuming it isn't an Allison Automatic) and transfer case can be inspected with the same logic.

Hope this helps and that it can be useful... #1 is fill/level and obviously #3 is drain.

 

[Jacob2027]

Jacob I do have one suggestion for you and that is to get a set of Technical Manuals for your truck or they can be found on this website for free! When you talking about your truck it sounds like your doing way more poking around rather haphazardly looking for some result? If you have the the TMs you will be able to research the issues, then examine how to fix them and the TMs will take you step by step through all the steps to take care of the problem. These trucks are fairly forgiving in some ways but in others you do need to know what your doing or you WILL DAMAGE something Now you may have a very big expense on your hands!!
Good luck!

I have all tms I could find downloaded related to operation tm9-2320-209-10, lube lo9-2320-209-12, maint. Tm9-2320-209-20, and parts tm9-2320-209-20p

A lot of this stuff I am either having a hard time finding (the diff information) or must have missed/not remembered like brake psi. It really is a lot of info to take in quickly and while all useful to me seems placed somewhat haphazardly in the tms. The lo in my opinion while a great resource covers to much and to little at the same time. Going on to all of the attachments without going over all the fill ports and drains from the base model.
So I am trying not to poke around so much as get clairifcation and info I myself am having a hard time finding.

 

[Jacob2027]

Hi Jacob,

As far as finding the fill ports on the differentials and manual gear box - you could spend as much as a week rummaging the TM for location. My personal opinion is that who ever wrote them may never have actually even seen a MV! They are searchable as PDFs but you have to know the name of the thing you want more info about. That part can be pretty frustrating sometimes.

So, get yourself a big piece of cardboard or two and slide them under the truck. That will make it easy to slide in under and scoot around. Get comfortable. It should be relaxing to lay down there and look around. Grab a rag or two and bring your cell phone too - so you can snap pictures if you see anything that looks strange. We LOVE pictures!

Then, let's apply some logic to finding the oil level fill port (check port) problem:

1. You know for sure that the drain is on the very bottom. Gotta be that way so you can replace the oil when you get to that exercise.

2. The oil level can't be above the axles just because "that is how it is". Mostly because there is nothing but a little thin rubber seal at the end of each axle tube to keep the gear oil inside. So, around (generally just below center) you should see a plug that is about 3/4" in diameter. Some are bigger, some are smaller - but almost all will open with a half inch socket wrench on a Deuce or 5ton. Those that don't can be opened with a crescent wrench the first time - then get the right tool to put it back.

3. When you remove the plug, stick your finger in the open fill port, knuckle up and you should feel oil. It should smell like sulphur. Rub your fingers together. It should feel slick, not gritty and be dark in color. It if looks creamy and tan colored - you have water.

The picture below is a 5 Ton differential out of the TM. It is similar but different. Same rules apply to location and logic though. Gearboxes like your transmission (assuming it isn't an Allison Automatic) and transfer case can be inspected with the same logic.

Hope this helps and that it can be useful... #1 is fill/level and obviously #3 is drain.

View attachment 804444

Thank you for the info. Yeah I just looked at it like any of the standard trucks I have worked on and found them. The fill for the transfer case was in an oddball location in my opinion but used a light to verify what it was before using. The from diff was milky so i flushed it with fresh gear oil before filling. The very rear diff was a metalic looking one. Gears and all felt fine and looking in looked alright but something (felt almost like a bolt or pin) was floating in the bottom so need to pull the top off of it and pull it all apart to check it out.

 

[Mullaney]

Thank you for the info. Yeah I just looked at it like any of the standard trucks I have worked on and found them. The fill for the transfer case was in an oddball location in my opinion but used a light to verify what it was before using. The from diff was milky so i flushed it with fresh gear oil before filling. The very rear diff was a metalic looking one. Gears and all felt fine and looking in looked alright but something (felt almost like a bolt or pin) was floating in the bottom so need to pull the top off of it and pull it all apart to check it out.

Good Deal! The TMs definitely have a lot of info. When these trucks were on active duty, there were some parts "replaced as a unit". Out here "in the wild" that just means the training manual won't have any details about those "replaceable units". A good example is the rotation manifold on my wrecker... There is a picture of it in Dash 24, Book 3 but no details about the brushes that allow 24v power to pass through it to feed the spot lights.

Another thing worth considering is adding a magnetic drain plug to all your axles. Transfer case too if you can... That way if something happens - and it isn't catastrophic - the bad stuff will show up on the plug possibly allowing you to catch it during yearly service. I have found parts of ring gear teeth on them before. Definitely not good, but the truck was still mobile enough to "make it back home" under its own power because the magnet caught the broken piece.

 

[Jacob2027]

Good Deal! The TMs definitely have a lot of info. When these trucks were on active duty, there were some parts "replaced as a unit". Out here "in the wild" that just means the training manual won't have any details about those "replaceable units". A good example is the rotation manifold on my wrecker... There is a picture of it in Dash 24, Book 3 but no details about the brushes that allow 24v power to pass through it to feed the spot lights.

Another thing worth considering is adding a magnetic drain plug to all your axles. Transfer case too if you can... That way if something happens - and it isn't catastrophic - the bad stuff will show up on the plug possibly allowing you to catch it during yearly service. I have found parts of ring gear teeth on them before. Definitely not good, but the truck was still mobile enough to "make it back home" under its own power because the magnet caught the broken piece.

Makes sense about the replacement aspect. Like a buddy of mine working as a local fleet mechanic. He says if a part goes bad rather than service it he just replaces it. Where other mecbanics might service and rebuild. Just depends on the situation. Luckily from what I could tell (was hard as heck to get the metal off of transfer case and rear diff plugs) they are all magnetic. Also all of them where half inch drive plugs. Made it very easy.
Watched duece and guns on youtube do a transmission oil change and he had a super sized Alan plug and a half inch plug on his transmission... Pretty sure my sprag is sprung in my transfer case due to there being some metal in the gear oil. But it wasn't bad at all. Still one more thing to look at and service though. still better than a modern pickup to work on.... But wish Chilton had done a manual on them....

 

[Mullaney]

Absolutely Jacob2027 , having a Chiltons for these trucks would be pretty fantastic!

It is funny how it works. Long ago I worked for a place that had a "truck shop" and a "tractor shop" (tracked vehicles) and a "rebuild shop". If I needed a new hogs head, I could order it from our internal rebuild shop and if I needed the entire axle, they had those sitting on the shelf too. Outdrives for M4's were the same. Definitely a nice way to fix a truck or a tractor quickly. Only problem is, 40 years later and it is my truck that needs something - having been a parts replacer puts me at a slight disadvantage. On the other hand the guys who did rebuild were pretty narrowly focused. The axle guys knew nothing about transfer cases. The gas engine guys knew nothing about the multi-fuels, axles or gearboxes. Out here in nature, we will all definitely get better at "fixin stuff"! This site is pretty amazing and there are tons of folks that know a LOT about these machines.

 

[Jacob2027]

That is very true Mullaney. Most people in rebuild setups learn there trade and know it well but... That tends to be all they know. I have learned more working on my ownvehicles than be a part time shop assistant. (Aside from how nice power tools are) old me would have used a ratchet to brake all those plugs loose... These days... Half inch dewalt impact. Makes life easier and faster. Need an auto greaser though... Never been a problem before... Just need a little... Or a lot... Of elbow... I mean bearing grease...

 

[fasttruck]

Reference post 88: The -20 manual is not the place to look for info on locations on drain/fill plugs or what product to put in. This information is located in the lubrication order which in he case of a deuce is LO9-2320-209-LO. Most of the check plugs are pipe ends and a 1/2" drive will open them. As the Army would not issue a drive set to every truck, in your OVM there was a piece of 1/2" square stock and an adjustable wrench with which you were supposed to use to check fluid levels. If you were short you had to draw the oil pump from the parts man to add the oil. There is a list in the appendix of the operators' manual that describes the tools authorized for the truck. The usability codes are used to sort out which items go with each model truck: some are all" others unique to 1 model such as a wrecker.

 

[fasttruck]

A deuce without a winch has something like 40 grease points. Neglect them at your own peril. Universal joints require careful attention: have one come apart for lack of lubrication at 40mph is a character building experience as is having a slip joint fail also.

 

[Jacob2027]

Reference post 88: The -20 manual is not the place to look for info on locations on drain/fill plugs or what product to put in. This information is located in the lubrication order which in he case of a deuce is LO9-2320-209-LO. Most of the check plugs are pipe ends and a 1/2" drive will open them. As the Army would not issue a drive set to every truck, in your OVM there was a piece of 1/2" square stock and an adjustable wrench with which you were supposed to use to check fluid levels. If you were short you had to draw the oil pump from the parts man to add the oil. There is a list in the appendix of the operators' manual that describes the tools authorized for the truck. The usability codes are used to sort out which items go with each model truck: some are all" others unique to 1 model such as a wrecker.

I checked the lo9-2320-209-12 (listed on my trucks dash) it is very in depth with grease points but after hours of checking and rechecking I never found the diff, transfer case, or transmission information aside from volumes.
As for grease points I found the ujoints tend to suck if in the wrong position. My grease gun has a flex line but still couldn't get onto some of them at first.

 

[frank8003]

I checked the lo9-2320-209-12 (listed on my trucks dash) it is very in depth with grease points but after hours of checking and rechecking I never found the diff, transfer case, or transmission information aside from volumes.
As for grease points I found the ujoints tend to suck if in the wrong position. My grease gun has a flex line but still couldn't get onto some of them at first.

Get all the TM's for your truck in one place.
There are in >PDF format.
Open any one of them and type Ctrl and f at same time and you will get a search box upper right. Type in differential or what ever it is you seek and click enter. The litle box will then show anyplace in that TM that has the word diffeential and you can click thru all the references that way. Fast + easy.

Too many deuce TMs confuse the newer user.
All of the deuce TMs with 209 are one series, all of the ones with 361 are a different series. I believe there are between 10 and 12 books in the 209 series and only 5 in the 361 series. Stick with the 361 series until you get comfy with TMs.
Laymen terms.
-10 is the owners manual.
-20 (-24) is unit maintenance (do it yourself manual),
-34 (-35) is depot maintenance (think dealer service manual).
Manuals ending in P are parts manuals.

There is also really good PDF like GTA 9-1-1851-8 for you to work with

 

[frank8003]

If you are going to really grease it all then pull up the cab tunnel plates and grease things in there . That is the best way to tighten the jackshaft bolts, transfer lever pinnings, clutch cross shaft, and the FWD solenoid maintenace and greasing as per TM's.
Get used to taking it apart and putting together. I made up small tool to make it easier.

 

[SCSG-G4]

There is also really good PDF like GTA 9-1-1851-8 for you to work with

I have printed and laminated that GTA for each of my trucks in the log book. It gives you a systematic pre-trip inspection of your vehicle and some pretty good hints of where to look for stuff!